For more cynical ones, yes. But for most i think it gonna be "we'll try and see how it goes" instead of recently prevalent "big corpo is THE place to be" sentiment.
"If I could rent Pippa and Ulka, I would take them to a cosplay cafe and dress them up, then go to a playground where a Death Game was being held and the three of us would play!🎉😎💗"Utatane Nasa
-
🪦Notorious menhera Gumpai commits Total Career Death by slandering one of the most popular plushie makers in the industry.🪦 UPDATE: She has been removed from uwumarket.
🐟Sakamata Chloe, Hololive's Smelliest Orca, is pulling an Amelia Watson.🐟
🌳Fauna is graduating on January 3rd.🌳
🔥In light of recent events, please use this thread for the discussion of Hololive's Impending Flaming Destruction.🔥 -
:[💰 User Sponsored Segment 💰]:
🍹Ever wish you could just tear the clothes off your Dakimakura on those lonesome nights? In need of a body pillow with camouflage from disappointed family members? Or maybe you just want the smell of a REAL woman when holding your pillow tight? Wish no longer! The Mozumi Pichi birthday merch is here! Featuring strippable dakimakura, girl-smell sachets and more! Available to preorder until December 31st. Gao get some!🍹 -
ATTENTION: User Gintoki is organizing a TVA Secret Santa event. Please see here for details.
Hololive L Collection
- Thread starter reinigen
- Start date
So anyone can provide a permanent archive for this? I only have a free GoFile account and its 20 minutes long.
Its the part of Kiaras members stream where she talks about Fauna and the company in general.
Ii just clipped it in full, but I will add a write-up later.
but the TLDR is: There are many reasons why one might graduate, and "issues with management" is very broad and vague and while it sounds the same for us, the specific issues the talent might have might be completely different. There was no big change in direction or event one could easely point to, and the company changes really slowly and gradually (to kiaras frustration). The issues Talents might have with management arent big stuff but more like a death by a 1000 cuts.
Tbh this does no really sound reassuring. Sure this is not some big fuckup like what kurosanji did to Selen case, but it sounds like there is fundamental gap between some vtubers and the management. And that gap is gradually widening to the point we have one affiliation and one straight graduation in the EN side. (Not to mention the explicit "disagreement with management")
Something interesting that popped up on my TL.
I dont think Cover, a company with about 70 Talents and 600 employees is lacking in the back end department
Also, talent managers have at most 3 Talents under their belts, sometimes less, big people like Suisei and Calli even get multiple managers
Also, talent managers have at most 3 Talents under their belts, sometimes less, big people like Suisei and Calli even get multiple managers
sbm's summary of Kiara's stream
New
Good watch even at 1.5x.So anyone can provide a permanent archive for this? I only have a free GoFile account and its 20 minutes long.
Its the part of Kiaras members stream where she talks about Fauna and the company in general.
Ii just clipped it in full, but I will add a write-up later.
but the TLDR is: There are many reasons why one might graduate, and "issues with management" is very broad and vague and while it sounds the same for us, the specific issues the talent might have might be completely different. There was no big change in direction or event one could easely point to, and the company changes really slowly and gradually (to kiaras frustration). The issues Talents might have with management arent big stuff but more like a death by a 1000 cuts.
Here's a full transcript:
Yesterday, when I was streaming, I forgot. Like I knew beforehand of course, because we always get told before hand when there's graduations about to be announced or so. I knew it beforehand but then I forgot when I was streaming, because I was so focused on streaming. And then afterwards when I ended my stream, I saw the stream reservation and saw that you guys- the fans in genera- were already scrambling, and I was like "oh shit'. Ahh. "Oh right, it was tonight."
Um, yeah, and then... ah fuck. (Laughs.)
(Reading chat) "It's kind of messing me up not going to lie."
It's sad for me too, because I recently got closer with her, and was, you know, happy. Like, we didn't really click until recently, with Seven Days to Die. We had some good moments before but Seven Days to Die was really where I feel like we clicked. So I'm glad we had that, but that's too little, that's too little. But yeah, Seven Days to Die really special. And uh, I have, behind the scenes, I have been trying to get Grounded going. It might happen, it might not happen. Even if it does happen there's not enough time to finish it, a bit difficult. Yeah, I also, I guess I should do a Holotalk. Very very busy. I also want to do another Girlstalk with her. How am I going to do all these- I can't help her with the world tree, there's already so many other things I need to do with her. If she has time to do something with me, it's got to be- highest priority is like, Holotalk, to me, and then, Grounded and Girlstalk. I'd like to have one more.
I have a lot of thoughts, obviously, but... first and foremost, for me, it's important that Hololive is a place where you guys can find entertainment and fun and laughter and all that. And so I'm sad for the community that all these announcements are really dampening the mood, especially because these two were so closely announced to each other, it's even more emm- disheartening than usual. So that's really unfortunate that it came like bam bam.
I feel bad, because my whole twitter timeline is filled with pure pessimism - is that how you say it in English- yeah, yeah. Everybody's mad. I understand, people know, you guys know, I criticize the company a lot. Erm, but, I think I still do it nicely (laughs), and I don't even share half of the things I would like to share. But, I did want to say- I'm saying that because I want you to know, I'm not really trying to defend the company. I just want to say one thing to put in everybody's minds. Because one thing I've been seeing constantly on Twitter now, since Fauna's announcement, is everybody's like, "Oh my god, I can't believe once again management is the reason behind it, so they are doing something wrong! What have they done in the past months that is making everybody leave? They need to turn back around right away, fix this, like whatever they're doing it's shit, it sucks!" Everybody's focused on that right now, I see it everywhere.
And I understand, because, everybody- the girls that are leaving, they give such a vague, broad reason, and it just sounds like, yeah, management- it doesn't give a good conclusion, right? But, first of all, even if they wanted to be more detailed, I generally think they can't. So they have to be kind of vague. But that doesn't mean that they are really all leaving for the same reasons. Management, like disagreements with management, is extremely broad, it's an extremely broad thing to say. And from my experience, everybody has their own issues behind the scenes. Really, everybody does. It's very individual. Everybody has their own individual, unique problems and cases, and things that they're fighting for behind the scenes. Maybe there's some overlap in wishes, here and there, but I'm pretty sure that all these cases recently, they're all different stuff. It's not like one big bad thing that happened in the past months, that Cover's doing so wrong, that we can blame. Like, that would be nice, to have something to pinpoint so easily, but there's no such thing.
And also, even when it seems like everything is coming down at once now, that also doesn't mean that it's a particular thing that happened in the past six months or so. Which is also something that I've been seeing a lot on Twitter, like, people seem to think there's one thing that Cover's doing very wrong recently, and that is making everybody want to leave now. Just how everybody's issues are very individual and unique and different, everybody's timeframe of when they start discussing something like this to the point where it's announced is very different. So even though there's like one day between Chloe and Fauna announcing it, doesn't mean that they started this process at the same timeframe. So, there could be months apart, there could be many many months apart. And it just, through timing, scheduling, discussions, some discussions take longer, some take less time, some have different exit contracts, as you can see. And all of this takes different time, and there may be other factors that play into it, so- it's hard for me to put this into the right words I guess- but I'm just trying to say that, that it's not one thing that you can blame, and that we can ask management to stop doing!
Everybody is individual, everybody has their own issues and reasons, and I think mostly, in most cases, it all comes down to things building up, stacking up, over not just half a year, but like, years. Such as- if it were me, it would be the case. And, I- I- mostly, I only know like, big things, but for Ame maybe I knew a little bit more, but from what I generally know, you know, I'm not very happy with the company's decisions in some things either, but there's not like one thing that-. People even ask me, people even wrote to me on Twitter and they're like, "Kiara, you have to do something! Everybody's leaving for something that management fucked up!" But I can't do anything, first of all. I can't, I don't have such power, and there's nothing in particular that, even if I had more power there's nothing in particular I could fix. Again, it's like, things are like stacking up, and, you know...
And, also- maybe, once again, I'm unnecessarily talking too much. Thank god this is a member's stream. But (laughs), I just wanted to say that, there are more sides and facets- it's multifaceted- to this, these issues. It's more intricate than that. It's not so simple. It's not so simple as in "Oh, the company is now public for a while now and they're doing so much focus on performing, they're overworking the girls." It's not that simple, really. And also if it really was that, girls always have the choice to take a break from certain projects. They don't have to participate in every project. And they don't have to do a 3D concert like my recent one, you know, the YouTube ones. That's a lot of work, but they don't have to do that. Nobody is forced to do that. They can turn down sponsorships and they could turn down- pretty sure they could even turn down participation in Fes, if they wanted to. Stuff like that. So yeah.
But what I also wanted to say is, I know right now it looks bad, but I think this is just a normal cycle. Okay, so I've been here for four years, right? And we are still in the, or maybe... at least when I joined and the first couple years, this is the beginning of Hololive. And it was normal that barely anybody graduated and left, because it was the beginning. And so, people got used to that feeling of everything being relatively stable. And now of course it hits pretty hard when it looks less stable, but, this amount of time- I generally think from a western mindset, three or four years or whatever, is a very reasonable and normal amount of time you would want to spend in such a job. Especially if you were working for a Japanese company, and you aren't used to working for a Japanese company. But also, just generally, a streaming job, it's a mix of entertainment and all that. It's normal, I think, to want to move on with your life and do something else, and I know that also there's a lot of people saying "I don't understand why these girls are leaving because they make a lot of money and easy job, streaming, haha." Yeah, but even- I could argue with that too- but even with that in mind, money is not everything, and girls still might want to move on and do something else. As I said, things are super intricate, there's way more to it than what such a broad and vague reason might be able to give you. There's many factors behind the scenes that influence these decisions. I could give you a million reasons why somebody might want to leave in that situation. What else, what was I going to say. When- no- so basically, yeah, unfortunately, this is probably very normal.
(Reading chat) "It's League of Legends!" (laughs) (In a joking voice) "It's the fault of League of Legends!"
People say that you don't realize you were in, how do you say, the golden time, golden era, until it's over. People are kind of right now freaking out, and I understand, I understand. I want to freak out too. People are freaking out like it's the end of the world, and it's not the end of the world, at least I can say, it's maybe just the end of an era. And that's sad too, I want to go back and stay in the area (laughs at her ESL)- the era, the golden era. I want that too, but time goes by fast, and things change, and people's lives change, and people's wishes change. I wouldn't necessarily say the company changed. Honestly if anything the company changed so slowly and gradually, but also, predictably. So, because a lot of people are saying "Oh my god, the company changed so much. The girls can't- they don't like this direction." Neayahh- again, it's like more than that.
[Thanking a superchat]
(Reading chat) "Game perm issues." That's like the smallest issue, especially because, that was worse like two years ago or so. Now we have so many perms. You know, back in the day we couldn't even play Square Enix games. Now we can. So if anything that's getting better, I would say. Remember when I was so pissed, I was like "Oh my god, I just want to play Final Fantasy games." And then I played one and I was like, ohhh. But you just want the thing that they don't want to give you. But you know, we have, I think- it's annoying, perhaps, game perms, it's just one of the many things that could annoy you that could add up and stack up. But on its own it's not a big issue.
What pisses me off more is music perms (laughs). Music perms are honestly really, how to say, gatekeeping- that's not the quite right word- but it's something that's stopping me in my tracks, because I feel like I could make a lot of viral- somewhat viral- YouTube dance shorts, if I was allowed to use Kpop. Or at least test the waters, I'm not even allowed to test the waters. (Mumbles something in German) fucking- I can't, so don't even, ugh!
(Note: the remaining part is basically Kiara winding down the talk to her members, much less info and more just talking things out.)
And also, you know, I- I'm sad because Fauna and me, we clicked rather recently, and I wanted to do more with her, and also I'm worried about the community, and I'm also worried about HoloEN, and all that. But again, it's like, a normal thing to occur, especially after this amount of time that everybody's spent here. I think generally Japanese members will always, because of their work ethic, always stay longer. But yeah, when I was still an active idol fan for Hello Project!, they also- it was always like, some girls stay extremely long. Holy shit they are so, what is the word, tenacious. They're so tenacious. But some, aren't, and the always gave pretty vague reasons. The following reasons: Number one, a girl got fired, maybe for something. Now when somebody gets fired they go into a little more detail, but girls rarely get fired in Hello Project! these days. But back in the day they were a little more rebellious. In Morning Musume getting fired for smoking, or something like that. So that's like, getting fired, getting terminated, okay? They're going to make an announcement where "This member has been terminated, goodbye." They're not going to say much. And then the other reason, graduation reasons, they're either be "This girl is leaving the group and company because she wants to focus on school-studies," because usually they're pretty young, they're like teenagers and they want to finish school. Or "she wants to pursue different paths in her life," just generally, and that would usually be something like acting or whatever. Or, the other vague reason, would be health issues. And I guess this is still like a little bit more, a little bit more detailed, but yeah. It still always felt very vague. And as a fan I was always like "Man, I've been so invested in this idol group and in this idol, and now you're leaving me. Man, I was so into this and now she's disappearing, uhhh, what am I going to do. And you're just going to give me this vague reason, fuck you! I wanted to know more! I need this to have conclusion in my head." (Reading from chat) The closure, yeah. I totally get that. I always felt that way. Yeah, as a fan, you feel like you should know more. I personally also feel like you should know more, at least if the talent wants to share more. If they don't want then of course, whatever, but you've got to stay professional and can't really say too much. But it's normal. That whole process of you getting invested into something and then eventually, out of the blue, seemingly out of the blue, a person is just gone.
But I feel like with Hello Project! idols, the difference was most graduations and terminations always resulted in the fan really never being able to see what that idol was up to anymore. For the most part. Some maybe go into solo careers, like Suzuki Airi (sings Daddy Daddy Do). Who ended up being really successful with that. I guess I'm a bit lucky because my favorite, she became a mommy and started a mommy Instagram account, and it's just mothering, literally. At least I can still somewhat see what she's up to but then there's others like the absolute legend that was Tsugunaga Momoko, aka Momochi, aka the girl that Pekora really liked. And she's just gone, wiped from the earth not to be seen or found for years. No information where she is. And I can imagine if she was your oshi, you're like, "Damn, I'd at least like to know that she is doing well." And in that regards I think, at least, we have it quite good here. If you know what I mean.
(Read a chat message suggesting HoloEN should all graduate.) People would jump down bridges perhaps if we all graduated at the same time! You crazy lad. No, no no no. People would lose it. You can't take everybody away at once. But first of all, there's always like "I want to stay. You want to go, but I want to stay." But that's- nah, you can't do that (laughs). I mean, of course it sucks, when somebody leaves and the rest are looking incomplete or whatever. Yeah, that sucks, but would you really rather have everybody gone? Really? Come on, think about it.
So what do you think, KFP? Were my comments good? The things I just explained, does it make sense? Yeah? Okay, good. Okay.
I guess people are just really sad and worried, and so they want to blame someone. And obviously they're going to blame management for it. And I'm not a big fan of them either, often! But it's really, five dimensional. Or six or seven. Eight nine ten dimensional.
Yeah, it's totally understandable too. Also if I was a fan I would react the same way. I would be like, "What the fuck? What the fuck?! Is going on? What are you doing management!?"
I also hope, would hope, that many graduations would at least lead to conditions being better, becoming better, but I don't think so. It doesn't seem like it. Which doesn't mean that everything is bad, and again, it's very individual. Certainly there are many members who are perfectly happy, and they're chilling, and don't have many issues. So, I don't know, I have my issues, but I think for me, I still am holding on to hope. (Reading chat) "The pros outweigh the cons." I guess. I guess. But I do think at some point, even the pros in theory still outweigh the cons, at some point the cons can still not be tolerated.
Oh yeah, the one thing I want to say is, the streaming job itself is perhaps easy, although you need charisma and skill to be constantly entertaining. That itself is easy, I will give you that. But what comes to that, is when you stream to an audience of this size, to a level of this exposure, constantly being watched and judged. It's different from streaming to 20 people or so. Streaming to thousands of people every year and having debuts that are being watched by a hundred thousand people live, that weighs on you mentally, and that can do shit to you mentally that people seem to constantly forget. You need to be so mentally strong, to endure shit like what Nenechi endured, or what I endured if you remember about why I moved several times in secret, while trying to uphold an image of me living in the same place, because it would have been dangerous for me and I was paranoid as fuck. Remember that? There's a shit ton of that stuff going on behind the scenes too, not just for me, so- I mean for me, I can gladly say that it has been calm for a while- I hope so, but there's still some paranoia there in the back of my mind, constantly following me, and definitely making me act differently than I would without the paranoia and the fear. So, that can also very well be playing into somebody's reason why they want to leave. Like if I ever leave, I'll be glad to say "at least I don't have to deal with that anymore". And that's what makes this job hard. And combine that with this not being only a streaming job. We have- again, if you really wanted to you could probably turn down most of it- but we still have concerts and stuff, and dance lessons, and we have to record a lot of vocals, and we have these sponsorships, and we have other projects we want to work hard for, so that we have interesting streams like something in between all the normal game streams to offer, etc. And then at the same time we still have to handle our IRL. While there's fans out there who expect us to stream like, minimum five, if not eight or nine or ten hours per day. Any less than that and you're a "lazy bitch". So, how do you balance all of that? While behind the scenes still doing some work. And then also trying to live your life, like, go meet your friends, go meet your family. I rarely meet my friends and family, and I'm also really struggling with mental health. That's my argument to why do people want to leave this easy-ass job that gives you so much money.
But yeah, streaming itself is fun, and you guys- usually when I stream, I feel better than when I don't stream, because you guys take my mind off of things. You guys take my mind off of things and my mood generally increases. It's just nice to look at the community I have built with my hard work, and I'm proud of the things I leave behind every day. I love KFP! And I still- mmm- can I say that? I still love Hololive. I guess so, it's like saying I love you to my brother. Feels a bit awkward but (laughs). I still want Hololive to be a happy place for you guys, and I want Hololive to still succeed, and I still want the staff who are working hard behind the scenes, because there is plenty-
(Kiara is interrupted by a doorbell.)
Um, yeah, and then... ah fuck. (Laughs.)
(Reading chat) "It's kind of messing me up not going to lie."
It's sad for me too, because I recently got closer with her, and was, you know, happy. Like, we didn't really click until recently, with Seven Days to Die. We had some good moments before but Seven Days to Die was really where I feel like we clicked. So I'm glad we had that, but that's too little, that's too little. But yeah, Seven Days to Die really special. And uh, I have, behind the scenes, I have been trying to get Grounded going. It might happen, it might not happen. Even if it does happen there's not enough time to finish it, a bit difficult. Yeah, I also, I guess I should do a Holotalk. Very very busy. I also want to do another Girlstalk with her. How am I going to do all these- I can't help her with the world tree, there's already so many other things I need to do with her. If she has time to do something with me, it's got to be- highest priority is like, Holotalk, to me, and then, Grounded and Girlstalk. I'd like to have one more.
I have a lot of thoughts, obviously, but... first and foremost, for me, it's important that Hololive is a place where you guys can find entertainment and fun and laughter and all that. And so I'm sad for the community that all these announcements are really dampening the mood, especially because these two were so closely announced to each other, it's even more emm- disheartening than usual. So that's really unfortunate that it came like bam bam.
I feel bad, because my whole twitter timeline is filled with pure pessimism - is that how you say it in English- yeah, yeah. Everybody's mad. I understand, people know, you guys know, I criticize the company a lot. Erm, but, I think I still do it nicely (laughs), and I don't even share half of the things I would like to share. But, I did want to say- I'm saying that because I want you to know, I'm not really trying to defend the company. I just want to say one thing to put in everybody's minds. Because one thing I've been seeing constantly on Twitter now, since Fauna's announcement, is everybody's like, "Oh my god, I can't believe once again management is the reason behind it, so they are doing something wrong! What have they done in the past months that is making everybody leave? They need to turn back around right away, fix this, like whatever they're doing it's shit, it sucks!" Everybody's focused on that right now, I see it everywhere.
And I understand, because, everybody- the girls that are leaving, they give such a vague, broad reason, and it just sounds like, yeah, management- it doesn't give a good conclusion, right? But, first of all, even if they wanted to be more detailed, I generally think they can't. So they have to be kind of vague. But that doesn't mean that they are really all leaving for the same reasons. Management, like disagreements with management, is extremely broad, it's an extremely broad thing to say. And from my experience, everybody has their own issues behind the scenes. Really, everybody does. It's very individual. Everybody has their own individual, unique problems and cases, and things that they're fighting for behind the scenes. Maybe there's some overlap in wishes, here and there, but I'm pretty sure that all these cases recently, they're all different stuff. It's not like one big bad thing that happened in the past months, that Cover's doing so wrong, that we can blame. Like, that would be nice, to have something to pinpoint so easily, but there's no such thing.
And also, even when it seems like everything is coming down at once now, that also doesn't mean that it's a particular thing that happened in the past six months or so. Which is also something that I've been seeing a lot on Twitter, like, people seem to think there's one thing that Cover's doing very wrong recently, and that is making everybody want to leave now. Just how everybody's issues are very individual and unique and different, everybody's timeframe of when they start discussing something like this to the point where it's announced is very different. So even though there's like one day between Chloe and Fauna announcing it, doesn't mean that they started this process at the same timeframe. So, there could be months apart, there could be many many months apart. And it just, through timing, scheduling, discussions, some discussions take longer, some take less time, some have different exit contracts, as you can see. And all of this takes different time, and there may be other factors that play into it, so- it's hard for me to put this into the right words I guess- but I'm just trying to say that, that it's not one thing that you can blame, and that we can ask management to stop doing!
Everybody is individual, everybody has their own issues and reasons, and I think mostly, in most cases, it all comes down to things building up, stacking up, over not just half a year, but like, years. Such as- if it were me, it would be the case. And, I- I- mostly, I only know like, big things, but for Ame maybe I knew a little bit more, but from what I generally know, you know, I'm not very happy with the company's decisions in some things either, but there's not like one thing that-. People even ask me, people even wrote to me on Twitter and they're like, "Kiara, you have to do something! Everybody's leaving for something that management fucked up!" But I can't do anything, first of all. I can't, I don't have such power, and there's nothing in particular that, even if I had more power there's nothing in particular I could fix. Again, it's like, things are like stacking up, and, you know...
And, also- maybe, once again, I'm unnecessarily talking too much. Thank god this is a member's stream. But (laughs), I just wanted to say that, there are more sides and facets- it's multifaceted- to this, these issues. It's more intricate than that. It's not so simple. It's not so simple as in "Oh, the company is now public for a while now and they're doing so much focus on performing, they're overworking the girls." It's not that simple, really. And also if it really was that, girls always have the choice to take a break from certain projects. They don't have to participate in every project. And they don't have to do a 3D concert like my recent one, you know, the YouTube ones. That's a lot of work, but they don't have to do that. Nobody is forced to do that. They can turn down sponsorships and they could turn down- pretty sure they could even turn down participation in Fes, if they wanted to. Stuff like that. So yeah.
But what I also wanted to say is, I know right now it looks bad, but I think this is just a normal cycle. Okay, so I've been here for four years, right? And we are still in the, or maybe... at least when I joined and the first couple years, this is the beginning of Hololive. And it was normal that barely anybody graduated and left, because it was the beginning. And so, people got used to that feeling of everything being relatively stable. And now of course it hits pretty hard when it looks less stable, but, this amount of time- I generally think from a western mindset, three or four years or whatever, is a very reasonable and normal amount of time you would want to spend in such a job. Especially if you were working for a Japanese company, and you aren't used to working for a Japanese company. But also, just generally, a streaming job, it's a mix of entertainment and all that. It's normal, I think, to want to move on with your life and do something else, and I know that also there's a lot of people saying "I don't understand why these girls are leaving because they make a lot of money and easy job, streaming, haha." Yeah, but even- I could argue with that too- but even with that in mind, money is not everything, and girls still might want to move on and do something else. As I said, things are super intricate, there's way more to it than what such a broad and vague reason might be able to give you. There's many factors behind the scenes that influence these decisions. I could give you a million reasons why somebody might want to leave in that situation. What else, what was I going to say. When- no- so basically, yeah, unfortunately, this is probably very normal.
(Reading chat) "It's League of Legends!" (laughs) (In a joking voice) "It's the fault of League of Legends!"
People say that you don't realize you were in, how do you say, the golden time, golden era, until it's over. People are kind of right now freaking out, and I understand, I understand. I want to freak out too. People are freaking out like it's the end of the world, and it's not the end of the world, at least I can say, it's maybe just the end of an era. And that's sad too, I want to go back and stay in the area (laughs at her ESL)- the era, the golden era. I want that too, but time goes by fast, and things change, and people's lives change, and people's wishes change. I wouldn't necessarily say the company changed. Honestly if anything the company changed so slowly and gradually, but also, predictably. So, because a lot of people are saying "Oh my god, the company changed so much. The girls can't- they don't like this direction." Neayahh- again, it's like more than that.
[Thanking a superchat]
(Reading chat) "Game perm issues." That's like the smallest issue, especially because, that was worse like two years ago or so. Now we have so many perms. You know, back in the day we couldn't even play Square Enix games. Now we can. So if anything that's getting better, I would say. Remember when I was so pissed, I was like "Oh my god, I just want to play Final Fantasy games." And then I played one and I was like, ohhh. But you just want the thing that they don't want to give you. But you know, we have, I think- it's annoying, perhaps, game perms, it's just one of the many things that could annoy you that could add up and stack up. But on its own it's not a big issue.
What pisses me off more is music perms (laughs). Music perms are honestly really, how to say, gatekeeping- that's not the quite right word- but it's something that's stopping me in my tracks, because I feel like I could make a lot of viral- somewhat viral- YouTube dance shorts, if I was allowed to use Kpop. Or at least test the waters, I'm not even allowed to test the waters. (Mumbles something in German) fucking- I can't, so don't even, ugh!
(Note: the remaining part is basically Kiara winding down the talk to her members, much less info and more just talking things out.)
And also, you know, I- I'm sad because Fauna and me, we clicked rather recently, and I wanted to do more with her, and also I'm worried about the community, and I'm also worried about HoloEN, and all that. But again, it's like, a normal thing to occur, especially after this amount of time that everybody's spent here. I think generally Japanese members will always, because of their work ethic, always stay longer. But yeah, when I was still an active idol fan for Hello Project!, they also- it was always like, some girls stay extremely long. Holy shit they are so, what is the word, tenacious. They're so tenacious. But some, aren't, and the always gave pretty vague reasons. The following reasons: Number one, a girl got fired, maybe for something. Now when somebody gets fired they go into a little more detail, but girls rarely get fired in Hello Project! these days. But back in the day they were a little more rebellious. In Morning Musume getting fired for smoking, or something like that. So that's like, getting fired, getting terminated, okay? They're going to make an announcement where "This member has been terminated, goodbye." They're not going to say much. And then the other reason, graduation reasons, they're either be "This girl is leaving the group and company because she wants to focus on school-studies," because usually they're pretty young, they're like teenagers and they want to finish school. Or "she wants to pursue different paths in her life," just generally, and that would usually be something like acting or whatever. Or, the other vague reason, would be health issues. And I guess this is still like a little bit more, a little bit more detailed, but yeah. It still always felt very vague. And as a fan I was always like "Man, I've been so invested in this idol group and in this idol, and now you're leaving me. Man, I was so into this and now she's disappearing, uhhh, what am I going to do. And you're just going to give me this vague reason, fuck you! I wanted to know more! I need this to have conclusion in my head." (Reading from chat) The closure, yeah. I totally get that. I always felt that way. Yeah, as a fan, you feel like you should know more. I personally also feel like you should know more, at least if the talent wants to share more. If they don't want then of course, whatever, but you've got to stay professional and can't really say too much. But it's normal. That whole process of you getting invested into something and then eventually, out of the blue, seemingly out of the blue, a person is just gone.
But I feel like with Hello Project! idols, the difference was most graduations and terminations always resulted in the fan really never being able to see what that idol was up to anymore. For the most part. Some maybe go into solo careers, like Suzuki Airi (sings Daddy Daddy Do). Who ended up being really successful with that. I guess I'm a bit lucky because my favorite, she became a mommy and started a mommy Instagram account, and it's just mothering, literally. At least I can still somewhat see what she's up to but then there's others like the absolute legend that was Tsugunaga Momoko, aka Momochi, aka the girl that Pekora really liked. And she's just gone, wiped from the earth not to be seen or found for years. No information where she is. And I can imagine if she was your oshi, you're like, "Damn, I'd at least like to know that she is doing well." And in that regards I think, at least, we have it quite good here. If you know what I mean.
(Read a chat message suggesting HoloEN should all graduate.) People would jump down bridges perhaps if we all graduated at the same time! You crazy lad. No, no no no. People would lose it. You can't take everybody away at once. But first of all, there's always like "I want to stay. You want to go, but I want to stay." But that's- nah, you can't do that (laughs). I mean, of course it sucks, when somebody leaves and the rest are looking incomplete or whatever. Yeah, that sucks, but would you really rather have everybody gone? Really? Come on, think about it.
So what do you think, KFP? Were my comments good? The things I just explained, does it make sense? Yeah? Okay, good. Okay.
I guess people are just really sad and worried, and so they want to blame someone. And obviously they're going to blame management for it. And I'm not a big fan of them either, often! But it's really, five dimensional. Or six or seven. Eight nine ten dimensional.
Yeah, it's totally understandable too. Also if I was a fan I would react the same way. I would be like, "What the fuck? What the fuck?! Is going on? What are you doing management!?"
I also hope, would hope, that many graduations would at least lead to conditions being better, becoming better, but I don't think so. It doesn't seem like it. Which doesn't mean that everything is bad, and again, it's very individual. Certainly there are many members who are perfectly happy, and they're chilling, and don't have many issues. So, I don't know, I have my issues, but I think for me, I still am holding on to hope. (Reading chat) "The pros outweigh the cons." I guess. I guess. But I do think at some point, even the pros in theory still outweigh the cons, at some point the cons can still not be tolerated.
Oh yeah, the one thing I want to say is, the streaming job itself is perhaps easy, although you need charisma and skill to be constantly entertaining. That itself is easy, I will give you that. But what comes to that, is when you stream to an audience of this size, to a level of this exposure, constantly being watched and judged. It's different from streaming to 20 people or so. Streaming to thousands of people every year and having debuts that are being watched by a hundred thousand people live, that weighs on you mentally, and that can do shit to you mentally that people seem to constantly forget. You need to be so mentally strong, to endure shit like what Nenechi endured, or what I endured if you remember about why I moved several times in secret, while trying to uphold an image of me living in the same place, because it would have been dangerous for me and I was paranoid as fuck. Remember that? There's a shit ton of that stuff going on behind the scenes too, not just for me, so- I mean for me, I can gladly say that it has been calm for a while- I hope so, but there's still some paranoia there in the back of my mind, constantly following me, and definitely making me act differently than I would without the paranoia and the fear. So, that can also very well be playing into somebody's reason why they want to leave. Like if I ever leave, I'll be glad to say "at least I don't have to deal with that anymore". And that's what makes this job hard. And combine that with this not being only a streaming job. We have- again, if you really wanted to you could probably turn down most of it- but we still have concerts and stuff, and dance lessons, and we have to record a lot of vocals, and we have these sponsorships, and we have other projects we want to work hard for, so that we have interesting streams like something in between all the normal game streams to offer, etc. And then at the same time we still have to handle our IRL. While there's fans out there who expect us to stream like, minimum five, if not eight or nine or ten hours per day. Any less than that and you're a "lazy bitch". So, how do you balance all of that? While behind the scenes still doing some work. And then also trying to live your life, like, go meet your friends, go meet your family. I rarely meet my friends and family, and I'm also really struggling with mental health. That's my argument to why do people want to leave this easy-ass job that gives you so much money.
But yeah, streaming itself is fun, and you guys- usually when I stream, I feel better than when I don't stream, because you guys take my mind off of things. You guys take my mind off of things and my mood generally increases. It's just nice to look at the community I have built with my hard work, and I'm proud of the things I leave behind every day. I love KFP! And I still- mmm- can I say that? I still love Hololive. I guess so, it's like saying I love you to my brother. Feels a bit awkward but (laughs). I still want Hololive to be a happy place for you guys, and I want Hololive to still succeed, and I still want the staff who are working hard behind the scenes, because there is plenty-
(Kiara is interrupted by a doorbell.)
Others have summarized but here are some choice quotes:
- Everybody has their own individual, unique problems and cases, and things that they're fighting for behind the scenes. Maybe there's some overlap in wishes, here and there, but I'm pretty sure that all these cases recently, they're all different stuff.
- It's not like one big bad thing that happened in the past months, that Cover's doing so wrong, that we can blame. Like, that would be nice, to have something to pinpoint so easily, but there's no such thing.
- even though there's like one day between Chloe and Fauna announcing it, doesn't mean that they started this process at the same timeframe.
- People even ask me, people even wrote to me on Twitter and they're like, "Kiara, you have to do something! Everybody's leaving for something that management fucked up!" But I can't do anything, first of all. I can't, I don't have such power, and there's nothing in particular that, even if I had more power, there's nothing in particular I could fix.
- It's not so simple as in "Oh, the company is now public for a while now and they're doing so much focus on performing, they're overworking the girls." It's not that simple, really.
- And also if it really was that, girls always have the choice to take a break from certain projects. They don't have to participate in every project. And they don't have to do a 3D concert like my recent one, you know, the YouTube ones. That's a lot of work, but they don't have to do that. Nobody is forced to do that. They can turn down sponsorships and they could turn down- pretty sure they could even turn down participation in Fes, if they wanted to.
- I wouldn't necessarily say the company changed. Honestly if anything the company changed so slowly and gradually, but also, predictably. So, because a lot of people are saying "Oh my god, the company changed so much. The girls can't- they don't like this direction." Neayahh- again, it's more than that.
- (Reading chat) "Game perm issues." That's like the smallest issue, especially because, that was worse like two years ago or so. Now we have so many perms.
- What pisses me off more is music perms (laughs). Music perms are honestly really, how to say, gatekeeping- that's not the quite right word- but it's something that's stopping me in my tracks, because I feel like I could make a lot of viral- somewhat viral- YouTube dance shorts, if I was allowed to use Kpop. Or at least test the waters, I'm not even allowed to test the waters.
Sounds to me like Kiara thinks it's individual disagreements with management, plus problems dealing with a Japanese business, coming to roost over years. In her opinion, it doesn't sound like Cover's going to crash and burn, but rather will start bleeding several graduations a year and turnover will become the new normal. I don't think anyone is saying that's good, but it's not a single issue crisis, if you trust Kiara like I do anyway.
Last edited:
Having too many cooks can cause the opposite problem, where anything you want to do has to go through multiple people who don't properly liaise with each other and give you contradictory feedback.
I don't think Stars management is much different than holoEN and definitely not skeleton crew. I think the issue talents like Altare and Ame run into is being roadblocked beyond their direct managers because of Japanese corpo being highly risk-adverse.
It is like the whole thing around Christmas last year where Kiara was shut down from 3D Christmas collab because they didn't want Advent to have VR chat models for whatever reason all of a sudden or blocking gloveless handcam streams for vague reasons. If talents want to do anything beyond just streaming games or chatting, it seems to be a "no" from management unless you can somehow convince them there is no risk involved. All it could have taken for someone to just say "yeah, that's enough" is being told no for something that shouldn't be an issue one too many times along with whatever other stupid corpo shit they have to deal with.
That's just her coping for the reasons I already mentioned before. You can't turn down things like this without a significant damage to your reputation. And next time management will not even offer you to participate in a sponsorship or at the very least this is what brainworms will tell you. They aren't Reimu level desperate for money to stream Raid Shadow Legends so some sponsorships are probably thrown out by management to begin with, but you still don't want to take chances
God's Strongest Mozumite
Mega Mozu Milkers.
Early Adopter
ENTERING FLAVOR COUNTRY
Joined:
Oct 28, 2022
I would not use the Holostars as an example of Cover treating its employees well, lol. In fact, I'd mention some of the ways in which they do not treat Holostars well, but talking about that for the trillionth time wouldn't be like beating a dead horse, it'd be tantamount to going out into the desert, digging up the fossilized remains of a horse millions of years after its passing, and vaporizing said remains with an atom bomb.
You know, I've been through a few tough graduations in my day, hell, I've practically built my identity around that fact, but while I think you should be upset by this shitshow, I also think you shouldn't allow yourself to get too doomerpilled. If there's anything to look forward to from all of this, it's that Fauna will return as Lemonleaf, unrestrained and ready to give you the best goddamn content retarded Japanese businessmen would never allow. That's a better deal than I got with Namie, who only seems to stream when the fucking planets align (which, thinking about it, would be in character for her). Think of it this way: if you never paid attention to vtubers, you would've never found Fauna, and you would've never had all that fun and got emotionally invested enough to feel sad about her graduating. I think that's special, as gay as it is to say, that this nerd LARPing as a forest god managed to touch so many people through sheer force of personality and talent. So yeah, don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened, and all thatI really really love vtuber, but I'm really scared that they'll suddenly graduate, so there's no reason to pay attention anymore.
If I didn't know vtuber, maybe I wouldn't feel so bad
I like how every time a vtuber who has experience with either the idol industry or a corporate workplace in general, or both says something, there's 10 retards who work in the back of a McDonalds who go "nuh uh, she doesn't know what she's talking about, here's the truth".
Certainly, I'm just direct quoting her because it's as close to straight from the horse's mouth as it can be. Though I think there's enough examples of literal zero output for months that it's evident many of Cover's talents do turn down most of the opportunities they're given, Fes excepted. So I don't really accept that it's much of a rep hit, going on a long unannounced hiatus basically hasn't mattered for the girls who have chosen to do it.
From my point of view, the negative interpretation is it means that girls who go on these long breaks like Shion or Gura are welcome to coast, so it's not particularly positive when someone who has the option of coasting chooses instead of full break with the company.
The literal "who"s from Twitter people are posting like they are saying anything worth thinking about clearly know better than she does.
I didn't say she doesn't know what she is talking about, nor that she is lying, don't try to twist my words. She is optimistic in that everyone can genuinely take this as an option and have no doubts it is truly presented to them in good faith. When your boss tells you you can take a paid leave for a month because you've been working hard and deserve the rest, while shining a bright smile there are reasons to doubt he is not just testing you when no one in the company ever agreed to it unless they've been really sick. Or that others will not resent you for it because they didn't take it in the past. There is a massive difference between objective "they clearly care about their talents and don't want them to quit" and whatever nonsense your brainworms are telling you is really going on
Considering Kiara is a workaholic I wouldn't take her too serious on the "not overworking" the talents.
and if any of them can opt out of anything then why is it that the few times someone has not appeared on a concert was due to health issues
my only guess on "things changing" within the company is maybe some things became mandatory and it could be related to traveling to Japan every so often, that's one of the few things I could think of Fauna not wanting.
but again unless someone says something clear on what changed, and Fauna says what the disagreement was we can only speculate.
and if any of them can opt out of anything then why is it that the few times someone has not appeared on a concert was due to health issues
my only guess on "things changing" within the company is maybe some things became mandatory and it could be related to traveling to Japan every so often, that's one of the few things I could think of Fauna not wanting.but again unless someone says something clear on what changed, and Fauna says what the disagreement was we can only speculate.
I agree. There is no reason to ever disagree with what an entertainer says at face value. Their reputations, connections, personal friendships, managerial relationships, sponsorship deals, contracts, and NDA's have been proven time and again to have no impact on their public statements whatsoever. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool, and only needs to look at the sterling reputation Hollywood celebrities have for honesty and public disclosure to be proven wrong in their baseless assumptions. This is the same kind of logic that malignant, conspiracy-brained slanderers and communists use to attack politicians for impossible things like 'insider trading' and manufactured corruption scandals. Your trust in the system is what allows it to run properly, efficiently and for your benefit.
There is no reason. Stop noticing things. They all just love working that much and will take any opportunity to work. Nothing makes them think it's a bad idea to refuse, they never even think to refuse itand if any of them can opt out of anything then why is it that the few times someone has not appeared on a concert was due to health issues
Jokes aside, this does raise an interesting concept. It seems feasible enough to me that Hololive is suffering from a bit of tractor/trailer syndrome, with people like Mori and Kiara setting unrealistic expectations for how other talents are supposed to act. They're both willing to absolutely no-life Hololive to the exclusion of all other pursuits (you can argue that even Demondice's persona funneled back to Mori in various overlapping ways), and I'd imagine that most EN managers look at them and go 'well if they can do it, why not everyone else?'
I'm not blaming them, but it seems like a fairly natural thing to expect to happen. There's almost certainly some manager out there that has looked at Gura's numbers and growled 'yeah these are cool, but how big would they be if she actually gave a shit?!' under his breath.
You should look at JP not at this two. JP are the og no-lifers who don't even stop to think that maybe working yourself to death is a bad idea. They are the product of the system not it's inventors
