General Thread v4mirai: Brought to you by Brave

[NeneLOVE]

Got the whole part uncut in case she takes it down. Honestly sounds like Tsunderia PTSD and small corpos generally:

"You don't know what it's like to have friends message you wishing they could say what I said. To be stressing over this when they expected the company to manage things"
"I think it's fine to be grateful to companies for introducing you to certain talents, but you can be grateful to them and also say that they're not a good company."
"From experience, there's a lot of staff that gets hired or CEOs that typically respond with "I can't get to this right now" or there's no response.
"I think they forget that they're a company. If you were working a normal job in a normal company that will go "I can't do this task that I'm legally obligated to do for you because I'm too busy right now," that can't fly
"You should not use any company as an example of a 'good company' because you don't know what the talent had to go through to get their IP"

"I need all these male CEOs who have never interacted with young girls to stop opening VTuber companies"
"I think the problem is that most VTuber CEOs do not have the ability to understand how volatile, distressed and emotional girls in this field can be, and the empathy that comes along with that and I truly think that is the root of the problem"
"Genuinely, I think the best VTuber CEO would be someone who has a daughter"
Damn, PPP still catching strays years after the fact.

Don't entirely disagree with what she's saying that corpos should be more professional and held to more real-world standards, but I do wish she would stop essentially talking about how her currently-in-a-corpo VTuber friends told her these things and wish they could say it. Just stirring up the pot even more, actually just go all-in if you're gonna allude to stuff like this, name and shame, otherwise there's not much point.

Fishman gets a pass in her book, because he hired someone who did understand women, which she says is what you should do if you can't deal with them.

Yaaassss queen slay! Who is this bitch anyway? Didn't someone say she was involved with twitch?

 

[RestlessRain]

This is some very nice artwork. Works really well since Uruka is a huge DC comic nerd.

 

[Euthyphro]

Yaaassss queen slay! Who is this bitch anyway? Didn't someone say she was involved with twitch?

Ex-Tsunderia, genmate of Miori, Ember (PC), Rosemi (NijiEN) and Daisy (Idol).

And she was with Twitch but got laid off recently:


A A
Probably better known these days as the prime feeder of chuubas:

 

[kushami tasukaru]

Indie Urato Chieru playing a nostalgic game, the first Wild Arms.


774inc's Suzumi Nemo premiering her cover of Egoist's song during her 2nd sololive performance at 7PM JST.


VSpo's Aizawa Ema with her seiyuu voice.


Good news if you're not a streamer, VSpo's Tachibana Hinano and Reject's Akami Karubi want to get married. Hinaano is probably mid-late20s.

You need a lot of money for Karubi's meals though.

It's harder to marry VSpo's Aizawa Ema though.

Somehow she has lots of viewers with impressive cooking skills.

 

[Migoed Helmet]

TIL Tenma can't have kids

Aw.. man, that's too bad. Not sure if it's that Tenma has something going on physically or if she's just at that age or what, but I always root for the older chuubas to be able to get a decent guy and some kids of their own (nothing against adoption, it's just very different). It's one of the things anybody should have the right to do if they feel like it, I'm a little sad for her.

 

[God's Tastiest Bucko]

 

[NeneLOVE]

Ex-Tsunderia, genmate of Miori, Ember (PC), Rosemi (NijiEN) and Daisy (Idol).

And she was with Twitch but got laid off recently:


A A
Probably better known these days as the prime feeder of chuubas:

Love that. Love that a bitch who worked for TWITCH of all companies is lecturing anyone about good companies.

 

[Aquatic Novellite]

Don't forget the JP Vtuber couple who did sex ASMR and then graduated when she got pregnant

She never graduated, she escalated from sex ASMR with her husband to NTR ASMR with fans. Starts here. Original discovery here.

As an actual fucking homo

I just have to ask: Is your choosen name inspired by Otter of my Life?

View attachment 91225

His twitter is literally indistinguishable from a white guy.

He's culturally bleached.

 

[Hff201]

Got the whole part uncut in case she takes it down. Honestly sounds like Tsunderia PTSD and small corpos generally:

"You don't know what it's like to have friends message you wishing they could say what I said. To be stressing over this when they expected the company to manage things"
"I think it's fine to be grateful to companies for introducing you to certain talents, but you can be grateful to them and also say that they're not a good company."
"From experience, there's a lot of staff that gets hired or CEOs that typically respond with "I can't get to this right now" or there's no response.
"I think they forget that they're a company. If you were working a normal job in a normal company that will go "I can't do this task that I'm legally obligated to do for you because I'm too busy right now," that can't fly
"You should not use any company as an example of a 'good company' because you don't know what the talent had to go through to get their IP"

"I need all these male CEOs who have never interacted with young girls to stop opening VTuber companies"
"I think the problem is that most VTuber CEOs do not have the ability to understand how volatile, distressed and emotional girls in this field can be, and the empathy that comes along with that and I truly think that is the root of the problem"
"Genuinely, I think the best VTuber CEO would be someone who has a daughter"
Damn, PPP still catching strays years after the fact.

Don't entirely disagree with what she's saying that corpos should be more professional and held to more real-world standards, but I do wish she would stop essentially talking about how her currently-in-a-corpo VTuber friends told her these things and wish they could say it. Just stirring up the pot even more, actually just go all-in if you're gonna allude to stuff like this, name and shame, otherwise there's not much point.

Tsunderia was a shitshow, we know this, but in general my sympathy is very limited on the basis that intellectual property ownership agreements are business arrangements. If these women are old enough to sign a legally-binding contract, it's their responsibility to make sure they agree with the terms up-front, rather than complaining about it later.

The thing is, none of the current conversations about IP ownership will lead to anything productive, because no reputable corporation run by actually competent businessmen is going to give away IP they invested good money into for free. All it will lead to is even more virtue-signal corpos from wannabe girlbosses and Discord groomers that run out of money and die a year in, with plenty of infighting to go around because the kind of people who prioritise farming Twitter engagement tend not to be the best judges of character.

 

[NeneLOVE]

Tsunderia was a shitshow, we know this, but in general my sympathy is very limited on the basis that intellectual property ownership agreements are business arrangements. If these women are old enough to sign a legally-binding contract, it's their responsibility to make sure they agree with the terms up-front, rather than complaining about it later.

The thing is, none of the current conversations about IP ownership will lead to anything productive, because no reputable corporation run by actually competent businessmen is going to give away IP they invested good money into for free. All it will lead to is even more virtue-signal corpos from wannabe girlbosses and Discord groomers that run out of money and die a year in, with plenty of infighting to go around because the kind of people who prioritise farming Twitter engagement tend not to be the best judges of character.

Vshojo and co have given a lot of people a very skewed outlook on how things work normally.

When it comes to IP, as you said, corpos have no fucking obligation to give it to you when you leave, it's theirs and they developed it for you to use during your tenure at the company. And this is the case in almost all entertainment industries which involve characters that aren't just the person themselves, if I VA some anime character I don't get to keep the property rights to that character when I leave. But vtubing is a hobby for many people, many people get attached to their characters and think "oh it should be mine", the blurring of the line between person and character that makes vtubing so charming also makes people loose their sense of "this is a job".

But then people will say "Aha! but a conventional VA can say they played the character! That's what they get out of it!" and that is true, vtubing does not have conventional public resumes, and at least in japan it won't for the foreseeable future. That does make it seem like the agency wins, the have all of the cards, but the balancing factor is that they don't get to keep the character either. Once the chuuba graduates, both parties are deprived of the IP, in conventional industries the company could just hire another VA and keep making money, here the money is lost forever and thus the company must seek to keep their talents in.

This is how vtubing works, these micro-corpos giving away IP rights only do so because they're literally disappearing. And I have spoken plenty on why agencies like vshojo work by leeching on the popularity of their hires, in truth vshojo could not exist without other corpos to do the dirty work of finding/making famous the talent they can later poach. They just take the credit of "saving" people without really having to do anything.

Nobody in this industry is a good samaritan, there are simply models and business dealings. Even companies like Hyte or Kawa do what they do because it's good PR, they simply profit off of drama by making themselves look like the good guys. I can only hope in vain that people stop trying to look for whatever affiliation gives them a sense of moral superiority and just like things because they actually like them, this rat-race to point fingers at shit and label it evil because tis the drama of the week and I need my updoots is getting tiring.

 

[CalciumAnimal]

Vshojo and co have given a lot of people a very skewed outlook on how things work normally.

When it comes to IP, as you said, corpos have no fucking obligation to give it to you when you leave, it's theirs and they developed it for you to use during your tenure at the company. And this is the case in almost all entertainment industries which involve characters that aren't just the person themselves, if I VA some anime character I don't get to keep the property rights to that character when I leave. But vtubing is a hobby for many people, many people get attached to their characters and think "oh it should be mine", the blurring of the line between person and character that makes vtubing so charming also makes people loose their sense of "this is a job".

But then people will say "Aha! but a conventional VA can say they played the character! That's what they get out of it!" and that is true, vtubing does not have conventional public resumes, and at least in japan it won't for the foreseeable future. That does make it seem like the agency wins, the have all of the cards, but the balancing factor is that they don't get to keep the character either. Once the chuuba graduates, both parties are deprived of the IP, in conventional industries the company could just hire another VA and keep making money, here the money is lost forever and thus the company must seek to keep their talents in.

This is how vtubing works, these micro-corpos giving away IP rights only do so because they're literally disappearing. And I have spoken plenty on why agencies like vshojo work by leeching on the popularity of their hires, in truth vshojo could not exist without other corpos to do the dirty work of finding/making famous the talent they can later poach. They just take the credit of "saving" people without really having to do anything.

Nobody in this industry is a good samaritan, there are simply models and business dealings. Even companies like Hyte or Kawa do what they do because it's good PR, they simply profit off of drama by making themselves look like the good guys. I can only hope in vain that people stop trying to look for whatever affiliation gives them a sense of moral superiority and just like things because they actually like them, this rat-race to point fingers at shit and label it evil because tis the drama of the week and I need my updoots is getting tiring.

they hated him for speaking the truth.

 

[The Proctor]

People bitching about vtubers not aligning with them politically just don't make sense because...none of them do.

Kirsche aligns with my politics almost perfectly and that's why I watch her.

"Genuinely, I think the best VTuber CEO would be someone who has a daughter"

@reinigen I'm ready to invest in your startup proposal whenever you have the time.

 

[Euthyphro]

This is how vtubing works, these micro-corpos giving away IP rights only do so because they're literally disappearing. And I have spoken plenty on why agencies like vshojo work by leeching on the popularity of their hires, in truth vshojo could not exist without other corpos to do the dirty work of finding/making famous the talent they can later poach. They just take the credit of "saving" people without really having to do anything.

I agree. Corpos still play a role as a selection mechanism for the industry. Small corpos are like local or semi-pro sports teams screening talent for the pro leagues (in that respect, the hollowing out of the small corpo sphere is a bit concerning for me).

The IP is a corpo's main asset. Even Fishman is on record as saying that without the IP, the corpo doesn't have anything. He's said that he would give the Phase girls the choice to keep their IPs should the time come, but never anything about giving it away for free. Before last year, this was already considered a "progressive" stance as far as corpos go.

Observing the small corpo sphere, I think what has skewed expectations on IPs is the spate of closures in 2024, particularly Kawaii and Prism Project. The fact that they were owned by corporate conglomerates, but still gave away the IPs to the talents planted the seed of the idea that this should be industry standard practice, even for "traditional" corpos.

Of course, the argument can be made that the company bean counters figured it would be better to write them off as a loss instead of going through the hassle (and bad PR) of negotiating terms for the IP, but this didn't really register in the minds of the community.

 

[Lurker McSpic]

"I think the problem is that most VTuber CEOs do not have the ability to understand how volatile, distressed and emotional girls in this field can be, and the empathy that comes along with that and I truly think that is the root of the problem"

ME ME ME bitch it goes both ways. There's a reason why a bunch of male zoomers are unironically into hags/older women, once they get old the drop a lot of the bs. The toxic levels narcissism, entitlement and absolute lack of accountability bitches nowadays have is fucking insane. I don't say there aren't assholes who pray on girls for easy money but you have to at least understand that there are dudes who had all the empathy in the world and you lot made sure to kill all of it. At least admit that you fucked up by joining your corpo, is not that hard man.

 

[Kanna's Glowiest Assistant]

ME ME ME bitch it goes both ways. There's a reason why a bunch of male zoomers are unironically into hags/older women, once they get old the drop a lot of the bs. The toxic levels narcissism, entitlement and absolute lack of accountability bitches nowadays have is fucking insane. I don't say there aren't assholes who pray on girls for easy money but you have to at least understand that there are dudes who had all the empathy in the world and you lot made sure to kill all of it. At least admit that you fucked up by joining your corpo, is not that hard man.

Yeah, she completely lost me with that point. She's asking for professionalism standards on the corpo side that she herself admits the talent can't match, and that not expecting the talent to match them should be a crucial part of the way they run. Imagine saying that shit in literally any other industry.
And the worst part is that these chicks are for the most part college students in their early twenties at their youngest, but 17-18 year-old boys and girls in vocational school are expected and able to show up at their trainee jobs every working day at 8 AM and perform whatever tasks they're told to do. The fucking entitlement.

 

[httn]

Got the whole part uncut in case she takes it down. Honestly sounds like Tsunderia PTSD and small corpos generally:

"You don't know what it's like to have friends message you wishing they could say what I said. To be stressing over this when they expected the company to manage things"
"I think it's fine to be grateful to companies for introducing you to certain talents, but you can be grateful to them and also say that they're not a good company."
"From experience, there's a lot of staff that gets hired or CEOs that typically respond with "I can't get to this right now" or there's no response.
"I think they forget that they're a company. If you were working a normal job in a normal company that will go "I can't do this task that I'm legally obligated to do for you because I'm too busy right now," that can't fly
"You should not use any company as an example of a 'good company' because you don't know what the talent had to go through to get their IP"

"I need all these male CEOs who have never interacted with young girls to stop opening VTuber companies"
"I think the problem is that most VTuber CEOs do not have the ability to understand how volatile, distressed and emotional girls in this field can be, and the empathy that comes along with that and I truly think that is the root of the problem"
"Genuinely, I think the best VTuber CEO would be someone who has a daughter"
Damn, PPP still catching strays years after the fact.

Don't entirely disagree with what she's saying that corpos should be more professional and held to more real-world standards, but I do wish she would stop essentially talking about how her currently-in-a-corpo VTuber friends told her these things and wish they could say it. Just stirring up the pot even more, actually just go all-in if you're gonna allude to stuff like this, name and shame, otherwise there's not much point.

Fishman gets a pass in her book, because he hired someone who did understand women, which she says is what you should do if you can't deal with them.

Lol, lmao even. This is typical woman brain in full force. She wants corpo chuubas to have all the benefits of someone else's money but knows that these women can't behave as normal fucking adults and treat their job as a job.

This part in particular displays complete ignorance on her part

"You should not use any company as an example of a 'good company' because you don't know what the talent had to go through to get their IP"

They are contractors, they are not entitled to any of the companies assets. They knew this when they signed up and still made the conscious choice to join. Any pitybaiting after the fact just comes across as entitlement.

I like Yuuna but she should shut up and stick to feeding other chuubas.

 

[closedblas]

Love that. Love that a bitch who worked for TWITCH of all companies is lecturing anyone about good companies.

6 figure pay for entry level SWE. 5% 401k matching. Amazon RSUs. Unlimited PTO. Without Amazon's notorious PIP stack but all the insurance perks of FAANG.
What's a good company you'd like to work for?

Kirsche aligns with my politics almost perfectly and that's why I watch her.

Ah, she's a big fan of squatter's rights?

 

[White Stone]

But then people will say "Aha! but a conventional VA can say they played the character! That's what they get out of it!" and that is true, vtubing does not have conventional public resumes, and at least in japan it won't for the foreseeable future.

I've been thinking about this. While it's true that they can't talk about playing said characters in public, I wonder if they can still put it in their resume when applying for work.

For example, Bae probably included her work as Marica Bellerose when applying to Hololive, same with Fuwamoco with their work as Go Go Nippon.

 

[RestlessRain]

 

[Unseiso Dragon]

Can't our favorite angry Chihuahua do that as well?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't she live in the slightly less shittier parts of Europe? AND have a day job to boot? I think those would be the dealbreakers for joining Kevin's JP misadventure entourage. Iori could work if not for the fact that she doesn't live in Japan either, thus reducing availability.
So no, unless Fishman hires a JP staff member/talent who's both fluent in English AND can take a few days off to escort a crazy rich asian and his gaggle of sad girls around Akihabara, Clara would be the only option.

ETA: Speaking of Tenma