The Graduation of Magni Dezmond and Vesper Noir - WE'RE SO BACK ORC BROS

[Clem the Gem]

Now this may seem rather far-fetched, but has no one else considered Vesper may have got himself caught up in a Nazi Germany-inspired plot to overthrow Cover Corp?
Hear me out, the evidence is all there:

Field Marshall Erwin Rommel
Commander of 7th Panzer Division
Known for bypassing military chain of command, clashing with superiors
Implicated in plot to kill Adolf Hitler, 20th July 1944
Due to his heroic status, was given the choice of quiet suicide with his reputation intact instead of public execution

Vesper Noir
Scholar and academic advisor of Guild Tempus
Known for bypassing company chain of command, clashing with management
Disappeared suddenly, 10th July 2023
Due to his heroic status, was given the "choice" of quiet graduation with his reputation intact instead of public firing

What I can conclude from this is:
Vesper Noir planned to asassinate Hitler Yagoo

(In all seriousness though, this is some bullshit)

 

[Tamavitch]

The point of "graduation" was never a school thing, it's a euphemism for idols who aged out/got married and is a diplomatic way of implying that they are moving on to bigger and better things in a wider world (rather than being washouts, undesirable hags, or failures whose glory days are over). Also a lot of the time said idol would be moving onto tv roles and record deals and such that are in fact bigger and better (and more adult-world) than being Idol #4 in a group of perpetual preteens.
This holds just as true for the boys, or at least it hopefully will end up that way. It's up to them now, which I think will be a good thing. If we really want to stick to school analogies, they did not get expelled, they dropped out.
I am looking forward to a bright future where Lando does whatever and can collab with Randon when they want, doing what the fuck ever they want to do. Kson did nothing with Talent Freedom, but the boys will make good use of it. That much is for sure. I was sweating this all day wondering if Vesper hadn't really gotten fucked up in a car crash or some shit or whether, with his Holodream crashed and burned, he would fuck off into the wilderness for a year or something again. Seeing him pop up with his spear the minute the coast was clear is a breath of relief for me. Onward and upward, lads. Imagine in 6 months or a year, Bettel and Vesper and Magni in the Homohouse/Vshounenhouse, doing 12 hour Zomboid streams with whatever guests they want, a modded Minecraft server, Factorio, the works. All the Xcom a man can eat. It blows to not have Vesper goofing off with Bae and the Holomems but we can't have it all, I guess.
Special mention to my day one, first vtuber membership lady Kronii, who took a ton of shit and sorta fucked up but really stuck her neck out to support the boys when it was easy and safe to just ignore them. Kronii's courage to stick up for them, as it were, will not be forgotten.
We didn't lose the vtuber who invented Copium, we simply graduated beyond the need for it.

 

[Belle Delphine's Armpit]

Haven't seen this posted yet:


Randon/Vesper also retweeted.

Spoiler: screenshot

 

[Nenélove]

Graduating implies they will stop streaming with a grand send-off, but there's no send-off and they stopped streaming weeks ago. I don't know what this is but "graduation" isn't it.

It has never meant that, the only thing graduation implies is a child friendly way of saying the person left the company, termination is when the person really fucked up big time and they don't feel like softening the blow for the fans. This whole "parade of glory" thing was only a thing for Coco and Sana, it isn't some established thing talents get by default. Specially if the contract rrat is correct and it ran out so they couldn't play the characters anymore.

---

In other news, gotta love how /vt/ rationalizes their hatred for Holostars now that they are officially out of the door without stating outright that they're salty fucking unicorns who got cucked by their oshis:
>Magni/vesper "wasted their opportunity on holo" (despite the fact these shitskins wanted them out for over a year now it's a bad thing?)
>Some random baseless accusation that justifies hating them
>Vesper has anger issues/disrespects management
>Magni is an ironic weeb/a fag
>They must've done something truly terrible to get fired

 

[electronic elephant]

>Vesper has anger issues/disrespects management

People talking about Vesper having "anger issues" as if he's going around getting into fistfights every other day is an annoying rrat because when Vesper talked about it he said he'd thought he'd grown out of it because it had been so long since he'd had any problems.

 

[Coffee Filter]

Haven't seen this posted yet:


Randon/Vesper also retweeted.

Spoiler: screenshot

View attachment 41846

Randon also retweeted/liked this.

I kinda hope he gives a little insight behind the scenes as to what happened in the end, but honestly we may never know.

At least we still have Vesper and Magni's roommates that we can still enjoy. I'll def miss Grandpire and Maglord, as I enjoyed watching em while doing other things like FF14 or art. I'm bummed we won't get a farewell send-off, but it is what it is.

 

[hivfag]

I guess Vshonen could be a very possible thing. Honestly, if I was in Vshojo's shoes, I would go for that in a heartbeat. If they pick up Mysta too while they are at it and have Nina join their main branch. (I assume Nina was going to go to Vshojo anyways).

As for them graduating. It fucking sucks but I was expecting it. This guy has a pretty good reply chain as to why it seems to be more contractual related than anything else.

View attachment 41840

He does have good points, but I still think that would be unlikely unless they signed another contract to replace their initial one right before or slightly after their debut.

I believe that the contracts are signed at least a month or more prior to their debuts, and they should last at least a year or so. If that wasn't the case, I can't see why they wouldn't allow Sana to graduate after Council's 1 year anniversary.

Maybe Holostars contracts are different for Hololive contracts. It's most likely either that either this happened, or they signed a new contract to replace their initial one.

 

[100% not Hakka]

Gonna put the nogging to work on what I believe to be a pretty decent rrat, because god knows trying to get out anything resembling a coherent thought would result in a seizure (and a lot of MATI-ing) otherwise.

Something that strikes me as odd and that is rarely brought up is how this could relate to the new models.
It is rather clear at this point that one of the most likely explanations is simply contract negotiations falling through, but why only Magni and Vesper? Well, what else do they have in common? They both broke the mold by getting a 1.5 and a from-the-ground-up rework by a different artist respectively, and there is no indication of this coming out of either of their pockets. (please do correct me if I'm wrong on this last point. If I am, the whole rrat falls apart)

As we know from this oh-so-subtle tweet from Lando from a while back, he had always been dissatisfied with his base look, and seeing as Rando retweeted it, it's safe to assume he felt the same.

This makes me think that talks about new models/brush-ups had been going on since early this year at the very least, which would mean that contract talks were also in flux to accommodate. So, if I had to guess, the timeline might've been something like this:

The new models enter production early this year. Seeing as this is for all intents and purposes a very special exception being made for the two, management warns them that the recouping of costs will not reflect on their contracts at the time, but it will definitely be a point of contention once year 2 negotiations begin. The probably take a "we'll cross that bridge when we get to it" approach to the situation. Fast forward to the middle of the year - The models are complete and contract negotiations begin. Of course, no one in any agency ever stops streaming or working behind the scenes as they renegotiate their contract, so the boys carry on as usual and events continue as scheduled, which means the new models are announced and released. Meanwhile, behind the scenes, the boys realize that the models' effect on their respective contracts was greater than they were told/imagined/hoped, so negotiations start to fall apart, resulting in the new contract not being finalized and signed before the old one's expiration, forcing cover to suspend their activities to avoid any legal issues. Months pass and they fail to reach a compromise. We are now here.

I might be retarded and unmedicated, but I think I it's a pretty plausible rrat... and this is the best my brain could muster after all the dooming and glooming.

Regardless, I'll miss them. I'll miss them a lot.

 

[sbm]

He does have good points, but I still think that would be unlikely unless they signed another contract to replace their initial one right before or slightly after their debut.

I believe that the contracts are signed at least a month or more prior to their debuts, and they should last at least a year or so. If that wasn't the case, I can't see why they wouldn't allow Sana to graduate after Council's 1 year anniversary.

Maybe Holostars contracts are different for Hololive contracts. It's most likely either that either this happened, or they signed a new contract to replace their initial one.

Simple, it's not a sports league, contracts have zero need to be strictly from date of signing for exactly 1 year.

A contract can have any time periods in it, and if Cover has any sense, it will outline one set of obligations during a pre-debut period, and another set of obligations when they start playing the character at X date and do so for Y time.

For example, even if the contract is signed in Feb with debut in summer, it may still say they're agreeing to play the character starting in June for 1 year even if they're signing on and starting pre-debut period in Feb and actual debut in July.

In fact this lines up better, because we know that most gens were brought on 3 to 5 months in advance of debut (Myth was 2-3, Advent was 5), and Sana's graduation would be well past the 1y mark if you held it strictly to signing dates. We also know that debut dates aren't 1000% set in stone and things can end up delayed. It makes sense to me to have some flexibility in any contract such that its dates won't line up exactly with debuts.

 

[Latte'Ninba]

I feel like people are too desperate to push a side here with still basically no info. At BEST we could potentially infer they got somewhat shoved out the door by JP corpo tism' Coco style. Otherwise I'm not sure where all the other shitting is coming from. The lack of graduation is a bit weird, but has happened before and Cover already announced they have to push back one of their group songs or whatever it was due to this not being in their plans.

Assuming we go off the info we have it's basically Vesper having various issues with management. Part of those being game perms, personal projects, and other silly shit. These aren't even issues new to these guys. Or even just THE guys. It's caused problems for numerous girls in the company too.
Maybe someone could spell it out something I'm entirely missing it but virtually nothing says to me there's some big issues that weren't contractual disagreement or JP corpotism fatigue. As far as Covers end in the "pushing out" bit, personally I wouldn't dump money into someone I'm trying to tell to get the fuck out.

If they start talking about some specific potentially related things on stream I could see the rrating. Sometimes people just disagree and go separate wats to do whatever they have to in life.
Has it been fairly uncommon in the scene? Oh for sure lol. But compared to Zaion's "And jaywalking" exit I think I'll see what happens before deciding who is the asshole.

 

[hivfag]

In other news, gotta love how /vt/ rationalizes their hatred for Holostars now that they are officially out of the door without stating outright that they're salty fucking unicorns who got cucked by their oshis:
>Magni/vesper "wasted their opportunity on holo" (despite the fact these shitskins wanted them out for over a year now it's a bad thing?)
>Some random baseless accusation that justifies hating them
>Vesper has anger issues/disrespects management
>Magni is an ironic weeb/a fag
>They must've done something truly terrible to get fired

A lot of them hate male vtubers, but I think a decent chunk of them don't really mind them and are just baiting.
Nevertheless, even if some of the points raised are baits, someone will inevitably agree with them.
Maybe there's some truth to what they are saying, but we'll probably never know.

The part where they say that Vesper disrespects management is mildly accurate at best. He had at least one instance of having an argument or a fight with management, but other than that he was always saying that he is thankful for his manager and that he did not wish to cause any trouble for them, going as far as not planning anything ambitious because it would take other peoples' (the staff) time.

Simple, it's not a sports league, contracts have zero need to be strictly from date of signing for exactly 1 year.

A contract can have any time periods in it, and if Cover has any sense, it will outline one set of obligations during a pre-debut period, and another set of obligations when they start playing the character at X date and do so for Y time.

For example, even if the contract is signed in Feb with debut in summer, it may still say they're agreeing to play the character starting in June for 1 year even if they're signing on and starting pre-debut period in Feb and actual debut in July.

In fact this lines up better, because we know that most gens were brought on 3 to 5 months in advance of debut (Myth was 2-3, Advent was 5), and Sana's graduation would be well past the 1y mark if you held it strictly to signing dates. We also know that debut dates aren't 1000% set in stone and things can end up delayed. It makes sense to me to have some flexibility in any contract such that its dates won't line up exactly with debuts.

Yeah, that may be very well be the case.

 

[Todd's Strongest Howard]

Seeing him active on his old ID, after so long absolutely radio silent, and seeing a lot of familiar names in the replies, I've got to admit, I might cry.



I hope he returns to streaming again sometime soon. At the very least, with the audience he would have now, back as an indie, he can FUCKING PLAY THE REST OF HITMAN 3 DO IT ORCFATHER

 

[Seth]

Gonna put the nogging to work on what I believe to be a pretty decent rrat, because god knows trying to get out anything resembling a coherent thought would result in a seizure (and a lot of MATI-ing) otherwise.

Something that strikes me as odd and that is rarely brought up is how this could relate to the new models.
It is rather clear at this point that one of the most likely explanations is simply contract negotiations falling through, but why only Magni and Vesper? Well, what else do they have in common? They both broke the mold by getting a 1.5 and a from-the-ground-up rework by a different artist respectively, and there is no indication of this coming out of either of their pockets. (please do correct me if I'm wrong on this last point. If I am, the whole rrat falls apart)

As we know from this oh-so-subtle tweet from Lando from a while back, he had always been dissatisfied with his base look, and seeing as Rando retweeted it, it's safe to assume he felt the same.

View attachment 41845

This makes me think that talks about new models/brush-ups had been been going on since early this year at the very least, which would mean that contract talks were also in flux to accommodate. So, if I had to guess, the timeline might've been something like this:

The new models enter production early this year. Seeing as this is for all intents and purposes a very special exception being made for the two, management warns them that the recouping of costs will not reflect on their contracts at the time, but it will definitely be a point of contention once year 2 negotiations begin. The probably take a "we'll cross that bridge when we get to it" approach to the situation. Fast forward to the middle of the year - The models are complete and contract negotiations begin. Of course, no one in any agency ever stops streaming or working behind the scenes as they renegotiate their contract, so the boys carry on as usual and events continue as scheduled, which means the new models are announced and released. Meanwhile, behind the scenes, the boys realize that the models' effect on their respective contracts was greater than they were told/imagined/hoped, so negotiations start to fall apart, resulting in the new contract not being finalized and signed before the old one's expiration, forcing cover to suspend their activities to avoid any legal issues. Months pass and they fail to reach a compromise. We are now here.

I might be retarded and unmedicated, but I think I it's a pretty plausible rrat... and this is the best my brain could muster after all the dooming and glooming.

Regardless, I'll miss them. I'll miss them a lot.

It makes sense. Its totally a jp corpo thing to give you a shittier contract than the others because they did somethong for you.

 

[The Holiest Hole]

The Vesper/Takeshi incident is suddenly a lot more understandable now that his blackness has been exposed.

Thanks Boondocks.

 

[46gumi]

It probably hit this Dingo the hardest since Vesper was pretty much an Older Brother or Father figure to him.

 

[hivfag]

It's frustrating to me that we'll most likely never know what happened to cause their graduation. We don't have anything to work with.

When Coco graduated she had a target on her back, and was clearly dissatisfied with how Cover acted (or rather, didn't act) to protect her.
When Sana graduated we knew that she had it rough since debut (by far the most affected by YouTube removing subs, her dog dying and that taking a toll on her), suffered an accident and was left with back problems, plus her job demands too much of her time, and I believe she saw Hololive more of a passion project of some sorts than anything else.

But with Magni and Vesper, what do we got? They just debuted their new models, they had projects lined up, and were even planning to collab when suddenly they went radio silent, then Cover came out with the first statement.

Some people say that "we shouldn't pry", and "it's not our place to know what happened", and if you want to believe that, fine. I just don't share the same mindset. We'll always be curious, and maybe something good can come out knowing what happened.

Maybe Cover was in the wrong and we should let them know we are not satisfied.
Maybe Magni and/or Vesper were in the wrong and, if the issue was severe enough, we should think twice before supporting them again.

That's just, once again, frustrating. Very frustrating.

 

[Scoots]

Haven't seen this posted yet:


Randon/Vesper also retweeted.

Spoiler: screenshot

View attachment 41846

Lloyd with the support

 

[hivfag]

It probably hit this Dingo the hardest since Vesper was pretty much an Older Brother or Father figure to him.

I can't bring myself to like Axel again after the politic stuff, but I do feel bad for him. He really seemed to like Vesper a lot, and Vesper, likewise, liked him a lot too.

Lloyd with the support

That's not-Axel, right?

 

[Scoots]

I can't bring myself to like Axel again after the politic stuff, but I do feel bad for him. He really seemed to like Vesper a lot, and Vesper, likewise, liked him a lot too.


That's not-Axel, right?

What political stuff?

Also here is Bettel

 

[Todd's Strongest Howard]

It's frustrating to me that we'll most likely never know what happened to cause their graduation. We don't have anything to work with.

When Coco graduated she had a target on her back, and was clearly dissatisfied with how Cover acted (or rather, didn't act) to protect her.
When Sana graduated we knew that she had it rough since debut (by far the most affected by YouTube removing subs, her dog dying and that taking a toll on her), suffered an accident and was left with back problems, plus her job demands too much of her time, and I believe she saw Hololive more of a passion project of some sorts than anything else.

But with Magni and Vesper, what do we got? They just debuted their new models, they had projects lined up, and were even planning to collab when suddenly they went radio silent, then Cover came out with the first statement.

Some people say that "we shouldn't pry", and "it's not our place to know what happened", and if you want to believe that, fine. I just don't share the same mindset. We'll always be curious, and maybe something good can come out knowing what happened.

Maybe Cover was in the wrong and we should let them know we are not satisfied.
Maybe Magni and/or Vesper were in the wrong and, if the issue was severe enough, we should think twice before supporting them again.

That's just, once again, frustrating. Very frustrating.

What I want to know is what was this investigation they were leading into at the start of it all that was given as the reason for the sudden cease.