"VAPANKULO!"Komachi Panko

Banter/Off-topic Thread & Community Stoning Platform

tragic amphibian

Well-known member
Joined:  Apr 7, 2024
I meant FDM mostly. SLA, FDM and SLS serve vastly different purposes, you can't just bunch them all together and say that one is better.

Even FDM is pretty damn accurate, any rickety chinesium machine gives you ~0.2mm accuracy out of the box. Also much faster now too, you limited only by material properties.
Also your SLS statement is plain factually wrong https://sls4all.com
For home users, 3D printing fills the same niche as Raspberry Pi, Arduino, or AI art: it's a way to get a toy project complete without having to learn much of anything. You could learn actual design and machining (and there's way more you can do on a cheap and crappy little Chinese minimill or minilathe than you'd think), you could learn actual electronics and useful PIC microcontroller programming, you could enrich yourself and learn the fundamentals of art... but nah, you'll just rely on something you downloaded and slightly tweaked to reach a "good enough" solution.

Yes I am making a blanket statement about 3d printing plastics, in general. So what is the print speed for any of the 3d printing methods for a modestly complex 3"x3"x3" envelope part? if your answer is anything more than a couple of minutes, it's useless for industry. Is it more than 30 minutes? It's useless for someone with access to manual machine tools (not because the machining is the time bottleneck but the setup and indication of the part). What plastics are we limited to with 3D printing? Mostly resins and styrene derivatives which are some of the most mechanically useless plastics out there. Nylon is a pain to 3d print with and you can't glass reinforce it in a print, reducing its acceptable use case scenarios dramatically.

That DIY laser sintering setup is a messy kit, looks like the sort of thing that makerspaces buy as a toy and everyone forgets about after a month or so, has a uselessly small work envelope, and the laser is 5 or 10 watts depending on configuration. This is all pointless because this is a PLASTIC LASER SINTERING PRINTER WHICH IS THE DUMBEST GODDAMNED THING I'VE EVER SEEN. I was talking about metal sintering so good job on failing to read the actual machine specs.

I'm talking about useful machines like a DMG Mori Lasertec 125 which is a mid-tier machine that laser sinters actual metal which is the whole PURPOSE OF A USEFUL LASER SINTERING """PRINTER"""". When you get into machinery like this the prices are not listed publicly so, for shits and giggles, I called the machinery dealer I use for my own shop to get a ballpark estimate (and to give them a late day laugh). Their answer was "$1.35 million estimated, probably a 7% discount if ordering multiple machines. We'd have to run a proper quote by DMG Mori to have a real answer." It's almost as if a machine with 10x the work envelope, a 2000 watt laser, and the ability to sinter real metal to make actual useful parts is, as I noted before, unattainably expensive for normal people. We will also ignore the fact that a real machine will probably require also 440v three phase power and a very large space to hold a machine that is probably 8' or 9' tall, based on the height of the control console. I can't get the exact specs because you have to register with DMG Mori for tech specs and I've already wasted too much time and don't care beyond pointing out how dumb 99.99% of hobby 3d printing is, in general, and how stupid you are, even outside of your takes on vtubers.

0.2mm/0.08" accuracy is less accurate than late Victorian age machine tools, let alone contemporary machine tools where a basic dimensional accuracy of .02mm/0.001" is the absolute minimum. I'm a lunatic with a 3 phase setup in his garage and a very large mill and lathe and I can still maintain 0.00025" accuracy on the lathe if I'm not getting fucked by thermal distortion and 0.0005" on the mill even though my DRO is 30 years old and my shop has no climate control to boot.
 

MerelyTourist

jkterjter jkterjtier
LM's Ladyboy
Joined:  Feb 5, 2024
For home users, 3D printing fills the same niche as Raspberry Pi, Arduino, or AI art: it's a way to get a toy project complete without having to learn much of anything. You could learn actual design and machining (and there's way more you can do on a cheap and crappy little Chinese minimill or minilathe than you'd think), you could learn actual electronics and useful PIC microcontroller programming, you could enrich yourself and learn the fundamentals of art... but nah, you'll just rely on something you downloaded and slightly tweaked to reach a "good enough" solution.

Yes I am making a blanket statement about 3d printing plastics, in general. So what is the print speed for any of the 3d printing methods for a modestly complex 3"x3"x3" envelope part? if your answer is anything more than a couple of minutes, it's useless for industry. Is it more than 30 minutes? It's useless for someone with access to manual machine tools (not because the machining is the time bottleneck but the setup and indication of the part). What plastics are we limited to with 3D printing? Mostly resins and styrene derivatives which are some of the most mechanically useless plastics out there. Nylon is a pain to 3d print with and you can't glass reinforce it in a print, reducing its acceptable use case scenarios dramatically.

That DIY laser sintering setup is a messy kit, looks like the sort of thing that makerspaces buy as a toy and everyone forgets about after a month or so, has a uselessly small work envelope, and the laser is 5 or 10 watts depending on configuration. This is all pointless because this is a PLASTIC LASER SINTERING PRINTER WHICH IS THE DUMBEST GODDAMNED THING I'VE EVER SEEN. I was talking about metal sintering so good job on failing to read the actual machine specs.

I'm talking about useful machines like a DMG Mori Lasertec 125 which is a mid-tier machine that laser sinters actual metal which is the whole PURPOSE OF A USEFUL LASER SINTERING """PRINTER"""". When you get into machinery like this the prices are not listed publicly so, for shits and giggles, I called the machinery dealer I use for my own shop to get a ballpark estimate (and to give them a late day laugh). Their answer was "$1.35 million estimated, probably a 7% discount if ordering multiple machines. We'd have to run a proper quote by DMG Mori to have a real answer." It's almost as if a machine with 10x the work envelope, a 2000 watt laser, and the ability to sinter real metal to make actual useful parts is, as I noted before, unattainably expensive for normal people. We will also ignore the fact that a real machine will probably require also 440v three phase power and a very large space to hold a machine that is probably 8' or 9' tall, based on the height of the control console. I can't get the exact specs because you have to register with DMG Mori for tech specs and I've already wasted too much time and don't care beyond pointing out how dumb 99.99% of hobby 3d printing is, in general, and how stupid you are, even outside of your takes on vtubers.

0.2mm/0.08" accuracy is less accurate than late Victorian age machine tools, let alone contemporary machine tools where a basic dimensional accuracy of .02mm/0.001" is the absolute minimum. I'm a lunatic with a 3 phase setup in his garage and a very large mill and lathe and I can still maintain 0.00025" accuracy on the lathe if I'm not getting fucked by thermal distortion and 0.0005" on the mill even though my DRO is 30 years old and my shop has no climate control to boot.
OK machining snob, continue to compare soft and warm :supermigo:
I have multiple FDMs, lathe and mill too. I use them all equally.
0.2mm accuracy for PLASTIC PARTS like enclosure and simple low-load mechanisms is very good, and you can achieve 0.05mm quite easily.
I print repair parts and gears for stuff like sewing machines and other low-ish load stuff regularly, even PETG works well enough.
> can't glass reinforce it in a print
Again, factually wrong. Carbon-filled PA is much easier to print and perform spectacularly.

About FDM time - ok smartass, trivial task. Go machine me simple 10*10*5cm plastic box with a screw-on lid, bunch of square holes, and 4 mounting ears. Or how it started - go machine me that stenographer keyboard enclosure. Then tell me how much material cost was. And how much failed part did cost. And how much all the tooling you had to use cost. I'll wait. Then machine a stacked helical gear for that random coffee machine (i printed one under a hour including modelling by the way).

Plastic SLS: isn't nearly as dumb and frail as you trying to portray it. You get part as uniform as it could possibly be without actually casting it. Metal obviously makes more sense overall, but for hobby shop... it's like 10 times worse than SLA, also powder is way too expensive. Nevermind laser control. Its much easier to cast aluminimum at home.

> my DRO is 30 years old
Dude my condolences, please get new ones, it's like 200$ now for 3-axis kit with 5um scales and nice big TFT screen. The only thing they sadly can't do is compound angles on a lathe.
 

God's Strongest Dragoon

Well-known member
Joined:  Mar 20, 2023
Most artist go to Rio and São Paulo and they're extremely dangerous but they usually go to the good part of those cities.
So you're saying Max Payne 3 was incredibly accurate?
 

Brosnan Pierce Brosnan

God's Strongest Smartass
Dizzy's Husband
Joined:  Apr 4, 2023
Panama was better anyway

(what is going on in here)

 

The Proctor

Manager Arc Unlocked?
Staff member
Lovebug Proctologist
Joined:  Sep 9, 2022
I absolutely hate canada more than you can possibly imagine, and the only problem with Mao's one-child policy is that it wasn't a zero-child policy. Canadian-Asian immigrant parents are hateful scum who should have their children taken away from them automatically by the state. Yes, the CANADAIAN STATE. It's still better.
 

sbm

Well-known member
Early Adopter
Archivist
Joined:  Sep 17, 2022
Sometimes I wonder what level of fedposting Proctor would reach if he knew the heritage of the Canadian users of this forum in addition to our IPs.
 

MerelyTourist

jkterjter jkterjtier
LM's Ladyboy
Joined:  Feb 5, 2024
I absolutely hate canada more than you can possibly imagine, and the only problem with Mao's one-child policy is that it wasn't a zero-child policy. Canadian-Asian immigrant parents are hateful scum who should have their children taken away from them automatically by the state. Yes, the CANADAIAN STATE. It's still better.
Chatted with Charlotte again?
 

shipmate_F

menhera addicted sister
Pipproject Producer
Joined:  Jun 21, 2023
So you're saying Max Payne 3 was incredibly accurate?
Yes actually, it's romancized but it's pretty on point as far as games go. They even got the racism kinda right, in MP3 one of the NPCs scream "go back to the zoo, tourist asshole", but people would use "gringo" instead.
If you want other parts that reflect it realistically, Modern Warfare got the favelas pretty on point: irregular shacks built on a hillside because the topography creates enough military advantage for druglords/cartel to protect their outposts, add many civilians in the middle and voilá, the police/army can't do anything. They try, but it comes back with a lot of rebuttal, it's the reason most brazilians will tell you RJ lives a civil war for more than a decade, everyone hates the police and the police is always on the edge because they arm 13 year olds with ARs. It's a fucked up situation.
 

Helmet-kun Backwards

Terminally addicted to pointless longposts
Joined:  Feb 29, 2024
OK machining snob, continue to compare soft and warm :supermigo:
I have multiple FDMs, lathe and mill too. I use them all equally.

Ok i will see how you will shower every day with wood, coal, 3kW cap of electricity and 50L gas bottles.
Showering every day in the winter is LUXURY.

This was a worldwide norm for many centuries, widespread ability to shower every day is very recent thing, not even 100 years old.

Why haven't you 3D printed yourself a shower then? :smugrys:
 

MerelyTourist

jkterjter jkterjtier
LM's Ladyboy
Joined:  Feb 5, 2024

RestlessRain

Well-known member
Early Adopter
Joined:  Sep 21, 2022

Aquatic Novellite

Freshwater Shiorin
Early Adopter
Joined:  Oct 10, 2022
Chatted with Charlotte again?
Could also have been a Doki stream.

Or an Elira/Enna/Millie stream.

And then there are Kronii and Ina.

Really, that so many yellow Canadians become vtubers tells us all we need to know about their parents.
 

Laidho

Avalon's Most Wanted
Joined:  Sep 9, 2022
1000002375.png

That was $2,000 by the way.
 

Zyklon Mag

I MISS BETTEL UUUUUUUUUUUU
Joined:  Sep 14, 2023

The Proctor

Manager Arc Unlocked?
Staff member
Lovebug Proctologist
Joined:  Sep 9, 2022
Naganon, congrats on the new wife! Make sure to not tell vendors its a wedding unless you want to pay extra. :pogrys2022:

He's really craving those sloppy seconds.
 

Superduper Samurai

Well-known member
Early Adopter
Joined:  Sep 10, 2022
For home users, 3D printing fills the same niche as Raspberry Pi, Arduino, or AI art: it's a way to get a toy project complete without having to learn much of anything. You could learn actual design and machining (and there's way more you can do on a cheap and crappy little Chinese minimill or minilathe than you'd think), you could learn actual electronics and useful PIC microcontroller programming, you could enrich yourself and learn the fundamentals of art... but nah, you'll just rely on something you downloaded and slightly tweaked to reach a "good enough" solution.

Yes I am making a blanket statement about 3d printing plastics, in general. So what is the print speed for any of the 3d printing methods for a modestly complex 3"x3"x3" envelope part? if your answer is anything more than a couple of minutes, it's useless for industry. Is it more than 30 minutes? It's useless for someone with access to manual machine tools (not because the machining is the time bottleneck but the setup and indication of the part). What plastics are we limited to with 3D printing? Mostly resins and styrene derivatives which are some of the most mechanically useless plastics out there. Nylon is a pain to 3d print with and you can't glass reinforce it in a print, reducing its acceptable use case scenarios dramatically.

That DIY laser sintering setup is a messy kit, looks like the sort of thing that makerspaces buy as a toy and everyone forgets about after a month or so, has a uselessly small work envelope, and the laser is 5 or 10 watts depending on configuration. This is all pointless because this is a PLASTIC LASER SINTERING PRINTER WHICH IS THE DUMBEST GODDAMNED THING I'VE EVER SEEN. I was talking about metal sintering so good job on failing to read the actual machine specs.

I'm talking about useful machines like a DMG Mori Lasertec 125 which is a mid-tier machine that laser sinters actual metal which is the whole PURPOSE OF A USEFUL LASER SINTERING """PRINTER"""". When you get into machinery like this the prices are not listed publicly so, for shits and giggles, I called the machinery dealer I use for my own shop to get a ballpark estimate (and to give them a late day laugh). Their answer was "$1.35 million estimated, probably a 7% discount if ordering multiple machines. We'd have to run a proper quote by DMG Mori to have a real answer." It's almost as if a machine with 10x the work envelope, a 2000 watt laser, and the ability to sinter real metal to make actual useful parts is, as I noted before, unattainably expensive for normal people. We will also ignore the fact that a real machine will probably require also 440v three phase power and a very large space to hold a machine that is probably 8' or 9' tall, based on the height of the control console. I can't get the exact specs because you have to register with DMG Mori for tech specs and I've already wasted too much time and don't care beyond pointing out how dumb 99.99% of hobby 3d printing is, in general, and how stupid you are, even outside of your takes on vtubers.

0.2mm/0.08" accuracy is less accurate than late Victorian age machine tools, let alone contemporary machine tools where a basic dimensional accuracy of .02mm/0.001" is the absolute minimum. I'm a lunatic with a 3 phase setup in his garage and a very large mill and lathe and I can still maintain 0.00025" accuracy on the lathe if I'm not getting fucked by thermal distortion and 0.0005" on the mill even though my DRO is 30 years old and my shop has no climate control to boot.
Ok but i want my shitty chink resin printer so i can print little resin army men and tanks in my man cave

So
maxresdefault (6).jpg
 

MerelyTourist

jkterjter jkterjtier
LM's Ladyboy
Joined:  Feb 5, 2024
Ok but i want my shitty chink resin printer so i can print little resin army men and tanks in my man cave

So
View attachment 77148
Man, cheap resin printer market went to shit with total infestation of shituboards and their retarded encryption (encryption keys were easily scraped btw, so doubly retarded)
 

Nenélove

Chief Commissar of Holochistan
Early Adopter
Nene's Pet Latinx
Latinx/Latine
Joined:  Sep 16, 2022
Man, cheap resin printer market went to shit with total infestation of shituboards and their retarded encryption (encryption keys were easily scraped btw, so doubly retarded)
Why don't you print yourself a brain for a change?
:whatastory:
 

Hff201

Pippa Fan, Failed Normalfriend
Early Adopter
Joined:  Sep 13, 2022
I just realised this ring business means Kira got cucked again.

lol.
 

I Wanna Die

Don't do drugs, blow all your money on vtubers
Joined:  Nov 15, 2023
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