General Vtuber Discussion (V1)

[agility_]

Kson always had this annoying "I know what's better for you than you do and I am never wrong" attitude, before, during, and after her Hololive days. Most of the stories about her interactions with others are "Coco bestowing her wisdom upon them" regardless of their own opinion. She has been on a record to not understand the way weebs and vtubers culture works, jumping to her own conclusions, making uninformed retarded takes and acting like she is the sole progenitor of truth. Just like she is doing right here, she made up some bs in her head, thinks it's true, and can't wait to explain to others how wrong they are and how right she is. Also acting like a sore looser still salty that she got booted from a company for trying to do things the way she was explicitly told not to do. Company has a public image they want to retain and uphold, and if your actions are going against it - don't act surprised when they don't want you there anymore and see you as liability. She always could've went to Nijisanji and just be like Gundou, but her retarded "I know the idol industry Cover promotes is wrong and I must save this poor girls" got her where she is right now

She's not wrong.

 

[Not-Username]

She said that Niji(managment OFC) are bullies for not letting her collab with some of their livers.Never said something direct against Holo and maybe even said postive things about them but this seems like an anti corpo talk about them being slaves and not being happy:
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Chat: It's the difference between following guidelines and being a slave.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: Yes! That's so true.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: And being a slave is NOT the most beautiful part of Japanese culture, guys.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: I'm trying SO hard to get rid of slavery, weebs.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: But if you're all into that slavery stuff, VTubing will be over in 5 years.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: Say goodbye to all your oshis.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: If it gets to where all the major VTubers are mere slaves, it's all over
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Chat: Would you get bashed for saying this?
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: Oh, I'm beyond caring about that.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: I'm just feeling alarmed at the current situation.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: Part of me feels like Japanese culture is being made light of, and it really rubs me the wrong way.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: So, I'm not telling you guys to not support those creators.
Taishi Ch. 神代大使: [EN] Kson: I'm just saying, what's most important is the creators' own happiness.

You conveniently left out that it is her direct reaction for chats remark to "that's the difference between following guidelines and slavery"

Is she hyperbolic? Probably. But her point is that corps are (and get worse) in constricting talent.
The same she is saying since forever and that talent should push back for more leeway.
"Talent freedom" was always an argument for her. Long before vshojo.

 

[Sankisei]

Oh my god the absolute temerity to suggest that livers have their own agenda independent of a company. This only comes off as anti-corpo if you accept the premise that corpos have to be slave drivers or you have schizophrenia and read lines that aren't there.

You conveniently left out that it is her direct reaction for chats remark to "that's the difference between following guidelines and slavery"

Is she hyperbolic? Probably. But her point is that corps are (and get worse) in constricting talent.
The same she is saying since forever and that talent should push back for more leeway.
"Talent freedom" was always an argument for her. Long before vshojo.

Yeah i get your points guys but isnt saying that Vtubing will be over in 5 years and talking about slavery is exxagerating ?

 

[God's Strongest Mozumite]

Oh hey, KSON's doing a stream today, I can't understand Japanese but judging by the thumbnail it looks serious. I should go to my favorite vtuber discussion forum, The Virtual Asylum, and see what the posters there have to think about-

 

[Watamate]

I don't disagree with her. But also keep in mind, kson has never been someone who has enjoyed the thought of a regular 9-5 job or any sort of authority. She created her own fake business to try and convince her parents that she was working, and prior to Hololive I don't think she held a regular job for any extended period of time. And if that is your experience then yes, being a "slave" to a V-tuber company sounds like absolute hell.

Compare that to people like Marine, who was a wage slave in a black company for years and knows what for lack of a better word "The Real World" is like. Admittedly, like even in Hololive Marine has gotten the shit end of the stick on occasion, like that Live that she spent months and tons of money on being canceled. Which Hololive then retracted and allowed her to do eventually anyway. But even had that not happened, I think Marine would not hesitate between either staying in Hololive, or going back to being a wage slave.

So I think the whole 5-year thing is bullshit, because not all members of Hololive have the lack of life experiences that kson/Coco has.

 

[hylic]

I just think it's retarded that any mention of is automatically construed as an attack at every other corpo. Niji and Holo and Vwhorejo can exist at the same time doing completely different things catering to completely different people, just don't be a lunatic that actually attacks talent for 'breaking the rules'. That shit should be between the talent and corpo and nobody else.

 

[agility_]

It's harder for Marine now that her sister literally depends on her livelyhood. She came this close to retiring when Coco left cover.

 

[Not-Username]

Yeah i get your points guys but isnt saying that Vtubing will be over in 5 years and talking about slavery is exxagerating ?

So I think the whole 5-year thing is bullshit, because not all members of Hololive have the lack of life experiences that kson/Coco has.

Like I said. Hyperbolic for the sake of argument (and picking up chats reaction)
Not the best way to argue and the rest pointed tatsunoko out.
Just adding that exactly this marine pushed back to management to get quite some wins

 

[Hotdogs Aplenty]

Pochi super chatted her daughter during the current Fes Expo recap

 

[lakyus]

Is she hyperbolic? Probably. But her point is that corps are (and get worse) in constricting talent.
The same she is saying since forever and that talent should push back for more leeway.
"Talent freedom" was always an argument for her. Long before vshojo.

This is a digression but Kson is the prime example of explicitly not helping her unleash whatever boundless and god-like levels of creativity she thinks Cover kept in bondage.

 

[Aquatic Novellite]

if her incessant ranting on every occasion about japanese corporations not allowing talent freedom(c) and having entire stream dedicated to promoting said talent freedom(c) to you is not being a bitter bitch about how restrictive was Hololive then I guess she just randomly gets salty over not being allowed to do things she wanted with literally zero reasons why she could be salty about it

I mean... the only thing that Cover (probably) prohibited her from doing was collabing with Melody.

Because that's the only thing she has done since leaving Hololive that she didn't already do in Hololive.

 

[Not-Username]

This is a digression but Kson is the prime example of explicitly not helping her unleash whatever boundless and god-like levels of creativity she thinks Cover kept in bondage.

I need a stamp for "the fuck do I know?".
We don't know what exactly she found constricting and what she wanted to do.
In the same vein we don't know what she tried to do and couldn't or if she is not as creative as she thinks she is.
We only get some glimpses. Some here try to extrapolate from that some deeper knowledge of the inner workings of corpos, kson, vshojo and whatever.
I don't buy most of it. Some things seem reasonable. At the end of the day we just don't know

 

[The Proctor]

This is a digression but Kson is the prime example of explicitly not helping her unleash whatever boundless and god-like levels of creativity she thinks Cover kept in bondage.

Basically yes. The inherently problem with 'talent freedom' is that it necessarily frees you from pressure to perform as well. Under a contact, Kson HAD to think of new ways to stand out from the crowd, and HAD to think creatively in order to push and nibble at the restrictions imposed on the regular talents in order to establish a distinct brand.

As a creative person myself, I know the difference between total freedom and obligated productivity. I came to hate my last job because it got soulless, but at the same time it gave me three years of very high creative output on topics I'd otherwise never have considered. I would probably have spent most of those three years spinning my wheels and staring at the ceiling if I'd been self-employed.

Sometimes you absolutely NEED a deadline and somebody yelling 'WHEN IS MY DRAFT READY' in your ear to get your ass off the couch and onto the writing desk.

As mentioned before, Kson is a serious NEET personality. She's lazy, unfocused, prone to stupid decisions and generally poor life choices. This is a woman who thought that it'd be a great idea to livestream herself taking sleeping pills and then playing with lit candles. That doesn't make her a person who NEEDS a wrangler to smack her all the time, but she's no Girl Boss CEO. She needs somebody imposing external order on her chaotic lifestyle for her real talents to shine through.

 

[Crush]

Reine talking about 4th FES

 

[Svarog]

Edit: Speaking of Pippa, she thinks when black people get gifted shoes they should be tied together and thrown onto a power line. Cancel her!

When I started watching the video, I thought he had no feet, but they present him shoes.

Idly curious; anyone know what Rei's timezone is?

Sydney i think. (AEDT, UTC+11)

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

 

[hylic]

Basically yes. The inherently problem with 'talent freedom' is that it necessarily frees you from pressure to perform as well. Under a contact, Kson HAD to think of new ways to stand out from the crowd, and HAD to think creatively in order to push and nibble at the restrictions imposed on the regular talents in order to establish a distinct brand.

You're too focused on the preventing yabs aspect of management. Creative freedom does actually mean creative freedom sometimes and not just "I want to say retard shit and be a slut on stream". Many of the most memorable moments in vtuber history come from talent pushing back against management to get something done. Ame having to fight and work behind managements back to get her 3D shit in, all the crazy shit Inchou does without permission or Marine getting her concert after bitching to management about it for months are examples of that. We don't see how many ideas are shot down by management because they don't want to relinquish control, take responsibility for a risk or set a precedent.

Sometimes management is actually wrong. Sometimes the talents ideas really are retarded/illegal. There has to be some way to push back though, or shit will go stagnant.

 

[Audi Vide Tace]

what is Bae’s actual age again

Honestly she wasn't wrong though. 2+ decades is pretty old in terms of pop culture. I doubt many would imply being in your 20's is old for a person though.

 

[Superduper Samurai]

This whole Kson thing is just autistic and confusing ngl

Id agree to say that hyper unicornism could be a major factor in Vtubing having a decline, maybe not as quick as 5 years but worst case scenario a hyper schizo murders their Oshi like contemporary idol autism and then wtf will the industry do at that point. But considering how the industry is going, unless that extreme happens it will probably go on for the next coming years

her saying she did it on someone's behalf and then saying she got the go ahead is fucking retarded since it just breeds rrats, even here where its mostly sane people wonder if its Kanata or Nazuna, idk if she is close to Gundou but considering she is one of the most recent kerfuffles (not caused by gachis but still) maybe people can go schizo over that


Talent freedom fell apart the moment Nazuna had to sadpost about the time she couldnt play Wizard game when the japanese didnt care about all the struggle sessions that were being performed with that game imo, although i do think there is a possibility VSJ management thought she would've been too menhera to endure tranny gay ops

Spoiler: More sperging by me

Also, to me its kinda funny that she hyper sperged about Gachis barely a week after Mike had her apparent autism spiel about still supporting them, surely that wont result in any autistic woman-friction in her incredibly stable gen-mate

Also interesting to see how she is thinking that people have been hijacking "weeb" or maybe otaku to also mean hyper gachi, i can definetly see it with some of the shitposting/schizophrenka on /vt/ about being a unicorn so Japan has probably had that for years

 

[The Proctor]

You're too focused on the preventing yabs aspect of management. Creative freedom does actually mean creative freedom sometimes and not just "I want to say retard shit and be a slut on stream". Many of the most memorable moments in vtuber history come from talent pushing back against management to get something done. Ame having to fight to get her 3D shit in, all the shit Inchou does without permission or Marine getting her concert after bitching to management about it for months are examples of that. We don't see how many ideas are shot down by management because they don't want to relinquish control, take responsibility for a risk or set a precedent.

Sometimes management is actually wrong. Sometimes the talents ideas really are retarded/illegal. There has to be some way to push back though, or shit will go stagnant.

That's my point entirely, though. A tangible barrier against doing whatever the fuck she wanted made her creative and gave her actual pushback. Now that she's in VHoeShow she has nothing to fight against. She can do a tits-out stream and nobody cares. She can whore her model out with explicit outfits and nobody cares. Why? Because there are no standards, nothing to push against. She can just do it, and have it be an empty, hollow, token effort to avoid irrelevancy via pandering instead of a glorious stand against management that pushed the boundaries and established new precedent.

 

[The Holiest Hole]

but there are times when the thread has shit on her for joining. Like the bikini model, when she joined, and the latest outfit. The argument isn’t you’re always hating on her for joining, because I never said that. The argument was that in this instance, you wouldn’t be complaining if she wasn’t in Vshojo

Nolan I swear to christ are you repainting all your old memories to fit your narrative? Apart from like 2 people going nuts in the homeland thread(and I'm pretty sure that was exaggeration because TALENT FREEDOM). The consensus was that the bikini model was bad and what was the point of leaving Hololive just to go to Vshojo. She can do what she wants but all of that "VTUBER FREEDOM" that she talked about in between the corpo switch was just her gassing herself up and it's still true today:

>She wants to be unique but in between and after her corpo switch most of her content has watered down to the same shit other vtubers do. Probably the only unique thing apart from switching between flesh/vtuber was using her Yakuza autism not only to audition for a role but getting the other finalists to come on her stream.

>She talked about how the dreaded "HOLO CORPO" restricted her from doing what she wanted and with her newfound VShojo freedom she's using it to YAB on stream more often than not. I'm fairly certain after 2 years the only thing they "restricted" her from doing was non-corp collabs because now her video history has more indie collabs that she clearly has friendships with offstream.

I know you want to use your certified "Nolanness" to protect the vtubers but please remember that not all the other people in the thread shitting on you are hate-filled schizos.